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Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

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Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#31

Post by tracker1 »

synkarius wrote: post #27
JonathonW wrote: post #24

Watching the PyCon talk the author mentions as inspiration, the thing that seems like it would really kill this for me (even given a good macro set for the editors and applications I need) is the input lag. The whole time, it seems like he's either pausing between commands and able to react to incorrectly interpreted input, or he's speaking a long string of commands and something goes wrong in the middle that invalid…

Like the author of the article, I've been making the switch to programming by voice. At first, the delay was really jarring, but you get used to it. You're also completely correct about how when you speak a chain of commands, one of the commands in the middle getting messed up can invalidate the rest. That happens a lot. You learn to speak in shorter chains, and also to make the commands phonetically distinct. That s…

I know someone who does a lot of voice input, he tends to use simple sounds that are distinct as a trained syntax... like: "woof" for moving to the end of a line, and "bark" for moving back.. and other words/sounds that aren't common in conversation... he said it took some getting used to but the accuracy got a lot better.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#32

Post by ericdykstra »

henrik_w wrote: post #30
flente wrote: post #28

EVERYONE who suffers from RSI should read this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1269951 I read it about a year ago, and it was probably the single most important article I've read in my entire life. Some background: I've been using computers since I was a little kid. Used to play videos games a whole ton. Around the age of 15, I started having severe RSI-related pain in my hands. Even after I stopped gaming, I c…

An alternative data point: I had severe RSI several years ago, to the point of thinking that I would have to stop programming professionally alltogether. What worked for me was starting to use a break program (10 seconds micro breaks every 5 minutes, exercises for a few minutes every 45 minutes) and switching to a more ergonomic keyboard and mouse. It worked well for me, and I am now completely recovered. More detail…

Yet another data point here...

After using the ergonomically suicidal Apple Magic Mouse and Apple wireless keyboard, I developed RSI after just a couple of months. I having my wrists and forearms massaged every night until the tightness went away (for the night), and I switched to a mechanical keyboard, a nice-sized gaming mouse, and started mousing with my left hand at work.

I haven't had any RSI symptoms for over 2 years, and still just alternate mousing hands (left-handed at work, right-handed at home), and use a mechanical keyboard without a 10-key (keeps your mouse closer to a neutral position for your body).

Here's what I use at work, if anyone is interested:

Mouse: http://www.amazon.com/Razer-Deathadder-Infrared-Gaming-Mouse...

Keyboard: http://www.amazon.com/Storm-QuickFire-Rapid-Tenkeyless-Mecha...

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#33

Post by roghummal »

billmalarky wrote: post #5
someotherperson wrote: post #4

This was a pretty interesting read. One thing I can recommend for those with RSI are Cherry MX Blue switch keyboards. As someone with fairly severe RSI, making the change from my normal rubber-dome keyboard over to the Blue Cherry MX switches about 2 years ago has made things significantly better. The pain and discomfort is largely gone-- its still there, of course, but its hardly noticeable.

I'm beginning to have some carpal tunnel pain brought on by heavy keyboard/phone use and my weight lifting regimen. What is it about the Cherry MX blue switch keyboards ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823201... ) that helps with RSI? Just looking at it, it appears like it would be even harder on my wrists.

In my experience it's not the difficulty of the key press that is the source of the problem. For me, it's "bottoming out". Without the tactile feedback (and maybe the sound, too) it's too easy for me to press a key "too hard" when typing at full speed and have my finger brought to a full-stop hitting the bottom.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#34

Post by roghummal »

flente wrote: post #28

EVERYONE who suffers from RSI should read this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1269951 I read it about a year ago, and it was probably the single most important article I've read in my entire life. Some background: I've been using computers since I was a little kid. Used to play videos games a whole ton. Around the age of 15, I started having severe RSI-related pain in my hands. Even after I stopped gaming, I c…

And you'll also get a neon-green stress ball, absolutely free!

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If you call in the next thirty minutes, we'll double the offer!

That's two magic books, two stress balls, all for the same low, low price!

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#35

Post by henrik_w »

ericdykstra wrote: post #32
henrik_w wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An alternative data point: I had severe RSI several years ago, to the point of thinking that I would have to stop programming professionally alltogether. What worked for me was starting to use a break program (10 seconds micro breaks every 5 minutes, exercises for a few minutes every 45 minutes) and switching to a more ergonomic keyboard and mouse. It worked well for me, and I am now completely recovered. More detail…

Yet another data point here... After using the ergonomically suicidal Apple Magic Mouse and Apple wireless keyboard, I developed RSI after just a couple of months. I having my wrists and forearms massaged every night until the tightness went away (for the night), and I switched to a mechanical keyboard, a nice-sized gaming mouse, and started mousing with my left hand at work. I haven't had any RSI symptoms for over 2…

Yes, Apple keyboards are ergonomical disasters.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#36

Post by querious »

I can't recommend a browser extension like Vimium highly enough. It allows you to browse the web efficiently without a mouse. Also: shortcat for navigating OSX dialog boxes, and Divvy for resizing windows with the keyboard. I hardly touch the gesture pad anymore (external one), and my shoulder thanks me for it.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#37

Post by phloxicon »

My wrist pain is so bad I've had to change profession. Nevertheless, computers are used in every job. At first, ergonomic keyboards and mice were enough. Then any kind of mice was too painful. Then I became fully ambidextrous, writing and using mice with left hand. After I maxed out the pain in that hand, I've moved onto tablets. I find almost no pain typing on a Swype keyboard on my tablet.

I got Samsung Note 12.2 2014 pro because it has a huge screen. If I need to do a small amount of programming, I use Splashtop to accept Swype input into my Windows laptop just across the room.

If anyone has better ideas for an extreme case of RSI, please let me know. Thanks.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#39

Post by singularity2001 »

Here is a rather conventional setup with which I completely got rid of my RSI:

1) Kinesis Freestyle2 keyboard

2) mouse that fits my hands (razr doesn't)

3) listening to the body (!)

4) stretching (especially in the morning)

5) Lots of physical exercise / gym / swimming

6) speech recognition for all text (emails+code comments)

I find it hard to believe that it can be cured simply by changing your mind, but knowing that there are cures certainly helps.

Almost forgot the most important part: a good chair. No slouching! Ever! This is more against upper back pain, but I guess neck tension is related to arm pain.

This is one of the best reasons for me to have a startup: to be able to work when and only when my body tells me that it's okay.

Re: Programming by Voice: Staying Productive Without Harming Yourself

#40

Post by unknownBits »

ericdykstra wrote: post #32
henrik_w wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An alternative data point: I had severe RSI several years ago, to the point of thinking that I would have to stop programming professionally alltogether. What worked for me was starting to use a break program (10 seconds micro breaks every 5 minutes, exercises for a few minutes every 45 minutes) and switching to a more ergonomic keyboard and mouse. It worked well for me, and I am now completely recovered. More detail…

Yet another data point here... After using the ergonomically suicidal Apple Magic Mouse and Apple wireless keyboard, I developed RSI after just a couple of months. I having my wrists and forearms massaged every night until the tightness went away (for the night), and I switched to a mechanical keyboard, a nice-sized gaming mouse, and started mousing with my left hand at work. I haven't had any RSI symptoms for over 2…

I am using a mechanical keaboard as well, and hardly have any signs of rsi. It's amazing to see professionals still using cheap and crappy keyboards as their main tool! I've invested in my computer gear, especially; good mouse, keyboard and screen (mind your eye's!).
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