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ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

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Re: ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

#31

Post by ANTSANTS »

lgas wrote: post #30
ode wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you explain what you mean by a reasonable text editor? Thanks

I suspect he means one that has paredit.

Even before that, it's shocking how few text editors have basic Lisp indentation and REPL support.

I guess I did forget about Light Table (as AFAIK it doesn't support Scheme or Common Lisp yet), which seems like the right thing to point beginning Clojure programmers to.

Hell, that's probably a big part of why Clojure became more popular than the previous Lisps.

Re: ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

#32

Post by lemming »

ANTSANTS wrote: post #17
skrebbel wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If Emacs is your thing, which it should be if you do Clojure, This is the kind of attitude that keeps people away from your language. The amount of people who shun away from C# simply because they don't like the idea of Windows / Visual Studio should be a hint.

That's more of a Lisp problem than a Clojure problem. All the Expert Lisp Programmers settled on Emacs many moons ago (as in decades past) and no one has bothered to write another (good) Lisp-friendly text editor since. And well, you can't really write Lisp without a suitable text editor, so all the Lisp neophytes either give up or learn to cope with emacs and eventually forget about replacing it.

all the Lisp neophytes either give up or learn to cope with emacs and eventually forget about replacing it.

This is really not true any more. LightTable is great for beginners, and there are more options for Clojure now. I'm developing Cursive, which is becoming pretty popular - Vim also seems to work well, Counterclockwise is good too.

Re: ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

#33

Post by kul_ »

klibertp wrote: post #29
nickik wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sweet.js brings the hygienic macros of languages like Scheme and Rust So it seams to clojure macro system is more powerful. That said that does not mean its better.

Of course, Sweet.js provides means for breaking hygiene. Also, Clojure macros are kind-of, a-little-bit hygienic, with their rules for identifiers resolution. Anyway, I'd say they're rather similar in expressivity and capabilities, but I don't know both macro systems well enough to do detailed comparison.

you can break hygiene in clojure macros using classical anaphoric macros. I guess that holds for clourescript as well.

Re: ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

#35

Post by macmac »

skrebbel wrote: post #13
macmac wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Emacs is your thing, which it should be if you do Clojure, DPPs starter project Spiffy, will give you very decent setup in a couple of minutes. https://github.com/dragonmark/spiffy

> If Emacs is your thing, which it should be if you do Clojure, This is the kind of attitude that keeps people away from your language. The amount of people who shun away from C# simply because they don't like the idea of Windows / Visual Studio should be a hint.

This was only meant as a recommendation, not a command. Lightable, Vim, Eclipse IntelliJ and quite a few others are perfectly viable alternatives. I have just personally found that Emacs to be excellent for Clojure development.

Re: ClojureScript, Lisp's Revenge [video]

#36

Post by nickik »

klibertp wrote: post #28
weavie wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I haven't looked into sweetjs enough. I was just referring to raw javascript macros.. (ie. non existent).

Right, in general languages without any means of syntactic abstraction feel contrived to me now, and after working with several macro-enabled languages I really want to have support for them in more places. JS (Sweet.js), along with Dylan and Nimrod (and others) showed that it's possible to have real macros in non-prefix languages - I wonder how long it will take the "mainstream" to become comfortable with this featu…

You might want to check out the PLOT langauges, its just a spec but a great read if you are into macros.
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