Why I’m No Longer a Professor • Hacker News Board

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#31

Post by RussianCow » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:19 PM UTC

javajosh wrote: post #29

jestinjoy1 wrote: post #22

"When I joined another institution that emphasized course evaluations, I saw that as an excellent sign of a more student-focused organization. Promotion and pay were based on achieving the highest student satisfaction ratings. But, I soon learned that statistically insignificant differences in evaluation scores determined wildly divergent financial remuneration. Savvy colleagues whispered that the quickest path to mo…

Teachers should be judged based on student evaluations - but those evaluations should be deferred until, oh, 10 years later when students can honestly and dispassionately answer the question: "did that teacher enrich my life, prepare me for the livelihood I'm actually earning today?" Of course, administrations can't wait 10 years for feedback, more's the pity.

Not to mention I'm not going to remember any of my professors in 10 years.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#32

Post by YokoZar » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:23 PM UTC

jestinjoy1 wrote: post #22

"When I joined another institution that emphasized course evaluations, I saw that as an excellent sign of a more student-focused organization. Promotion and pay were based on achieving the highest student satisfaction ratings. But, I soon learned that statistically insignificant differences in evaluation scores determined wildly divergent financial remuneration. Savvy colleagues whispered that the quickest path to mo…

My favorite variant of this trick is to conduct the evaluations on a day where only the most dedicated students will show up, such as one strongly hinted as being optional in the syllabus.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#33

Post by watwut » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:28 PM UTC

spaldingwell wrote: post #21

I'm 27 years old, I have a high income and I really enjoy higher education. At this point I don't care about getting my MA. I just really enjoy education for educations sake. But I don't feel like there are many places for me to go- auditing courses is the best I've come up with. I'm sure I'm not the only person who has this "demand" ... I just wish there was a way to connect the supply and demand in a better way :)

Did you tried coursera classes? Some of them are bad, but if you choose carefully you can have great learning experience. The way teachers work, difficulty and quality are very different, so there is high chance there is one that would satisfy you.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#34

Post by n0rm » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:30 PM UTC

walshemj wrote: post #14

n0rm wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. A diploma from a prestigious university only means you can go through better gilded doors. After that, your measure is how much money you helped your employer make. After a while, the metric becomes what you've done (in the past) to prove your worth. If MOOCs are taken seriously, and can compete with prestigious diplomas when it comes to that first job, then you've got a game changer. Sadly, the only way to make…

yes right so you get to work a MC Job instead of a good one - not exactly a endorsement for MOOCs is it. You go to Oxbridge/ivy league universities for the contacts not just the piece of paper

Exactly. You should be learning things in college, not kissing ass. That's the very definition of the downward spiral education is in.

Those contacts you make in big-name schools are mostly wishful thinking. Those places don't train you to be a friend. They train you to be ruthless, efficient "winners".

Make your FU money and bail. Nietzsche explained why;

> He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you.

p.s. a white collar mcjob makes more than an adjunct "professor".

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#35

Post by tdumitrescu » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:39 PM UTC

jestinjoy1 wrote: post #22

"When I joined another institution that emphasized course evaluations, I saw that as an excellent sign of a more student-focused organization. Promotion and pay were based on achieving the highest student satisfaction ratings. But, I soon learned that statistically insignificant differences in evaluation scores determined wildly divergent financial remuneration. Savvy colleagues whispered that the quickest path to mo…

This played a big role in my decision to leave a tenured position several years ago to go work in web dev. The university's increasingly biz-dev-oriented emphasis on student evaluations and quantity of diplomas pushed through turned the whole thing into a consumer-oriented relationship where you're expected to just give 'em that paper they're paying for. Shouldn't be the purpose of higher education IMO.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#36

Post by vertak » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:45 PM UTC

n0rm wrote: post #3

Disengaging from yesteryear's institutions is not going to help them. Best way is to force them to adapt. MOOCs seem to be the thing that will make education assess its business practices. I wish I didn't have to refer to education as a business, but alas, the idea that you can fine-tune any organization through business cases has been perpetuated.

If the universities are smart and look at the MOOC's not as a competitor but as a partner, then higher-ed can improve. I'm a college student now and one of our school's math classes experimented with flipped teaching. I think the emergence of MOOC's is what largely caused this my school's faculty to seriously consider the meter of online learning, to the point where they were willing to A/B test a required differential equations class. While the first results from MOOC's haven't been what people expected, http://chronicle.com/blogs/wiredcampus/from-a-million-mooc-u... At least, like one of the comments above said, they're making the established higher ed organizations rethink their practices.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#37

Post by Grae » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 6:52 PM UTC

pessimizer wrote: post #23

spaldingwell wrote: post #21

I'm 27 years old, I have a high income and I really enjoy higher education. At this point I don't care about getting my MA. I just really enjoy education for educations sake. But I don't feel like there are many places for me to go- auditing courses is the best I've come up with. I'm sure I'm not the only person who has this "demand" ... I just wish there was a way to connect the supply and demand in a better way :)

I do, too. I don't care about their stupid pieces of paper - I just want to learn more things. There's been a lot of ink spilled lately about ending the expectation that everyone should go to college. I'd like to see more about how everybody is expected to stop learning after that, unless they're looking for more degrees (or the ubiquitous MBA in marketing/finance), and especially if they have a good job. I think tha…

I find hilarious the widespread belief that everyone is expected to spend their first 22 or so years learning full time only to pivot completely away from education once they begin their career.

I've spent the overwhelming majority of my life as a student. I'm certainly not going to let that change just because I'm earning income now.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#38

Post by kbenson » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 7:01 PM UTC

RussianCow wrote: post #31

javajosh wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teachers should be judged based on student evaluations - but those evaluations should be deferred until, oh, 10 years later when students can honestly and dispassionately answer the question: "did that teacher enrich my life, prepare me for the livelihood I'm actually earning today?" Of course, administrations can't wait 10 years for feedback, more's the pity.

Not to mention I'm not going to remember any of my professors in 10 years.

You might be surprised. The teachers that taught you relevant things that you end up using over and over tend to be remembered in my experience.

Of course some courses lend themselves to imparting this information better than others, and if you end up in fields other than your major there may be less chances to find your learning useful.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#39

Post by watwut » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 7:36 PM UTC

kbenson wrote: post #38

RussianCow wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention I'm not going to remember any of my professors in 10 years.

You might be surprised. The teachers that taught you relevant things that you end up using over and over tend to be remembered in my experience. Of course some courses lend themselves to imparting this information better than others, and if you end up in fields other than your major there may be less chances to find your learning useful.

But then you are evaluating class he was assigned to teach and its relevance to your career, not his teaching. I did not used whatever I learned about networking or cryptography much, but that does not mean those teachers were bad. Nor does it mean CS major should not contain those classes.

Re: Why I’m No Longer a Professor

#40

Post by jjoonathan » Sat, Jun 28, 2014, 7:37 PM UTC

RussianCow wrote: post #31

javajosh wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teachers should be judged based on student evaluations - but those evaluations should be deferred until, oh, 10 years later when students can honestly and dispassionately answer the question: "did that teacher enrich my life, prepare me for the livelihood I'm actually earning today?" Of course, administrations can't wait 10 years for feedback, more's the pity.

Not to mention I'm not going to remember any of my professors in 10 years.

The ones you wouldn't remember probably weren't sufficiently different from the mean to warrant a positive or negative score in the first place. Meanwhile, the ones that you do remember probably were.

Just make opting out of each individual question easy (add a N/A or "don't remember" option). Sure, you'll collect less data, but I imagine that you'll get at least partial cancellation after multiplication by the SNR, possibly much more than partial cancellation.