Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC • Hacker News Board

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#31

Post by lilsunnybee » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 5:07 PM UTC

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #21

Am I being a little bit dumb - their goal is to demonstrate how corrosive money is in "buying" Congressional races by pouring money into congressional races to buy the race to make their point? I seem to be going round again

Not quite. They're raising campaign money to try and influence five upcoming congressional elections in favor of campaign finance reform. To do that, I imagine they'll run ads in key districts in support of whichever candidate or another will agree to support and advance reform, or at least to unseat an incumbent who's been historically against reform. It's definitely ironic! They even admit as much towards the bottom of the main page; it's just the way politics are in the US raising and spending this much money is pretty much a necessity for the goals they have.

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#32

Post by pessimizer » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 5:19 PM UTC

I need more words and less marketing to convince me to send my cash to people who have far more cash than I do. I need a very specific and very concrete explanation of what they plan to do with it.

Is there a deeper link to documents with more detailed adult explanations of what they plan to do, how they plan to do it, and the specific criteria for support for a candidate? One that doesn't assume that I'm ignorant of the current state of campaign finance, SuperPACs, and recent SCOTUS decisions? Maybe a few names? I assume something like this exists, but I can't find it.

Or is this just LessigPAC, and I'm supposed to give money because I'm a fan or something?

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#33

Post by RichardFord » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 5:54 PM UTC

pstop wrote: post #17

aragot wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting question. I'm located in Europe so I can't hear what the crowd is humbling. -Do you think there is enough collective desire for a particular change? It's often hard to rally everyone for a "spring". -Do you think this action has the power to overturn any decision making in the US democracy?

I doubt it, Canadian here so I can't speak to the mumblings. All I can off is anecdotal information from talking to Americans when I'm down there, and the middle class don't understand how poor they are in America compared to their wealthy. They seem to feel that they're almost wealthy, but what they don't realize is that the difference between the middle and lower classes is a rounding error compared to the wealth o…

All I can off is anecdotal information from talking to Americans when I'm down there, and the middle class don't understand how poor they are in America compared to their wealthy. They seem to feel that they're almost wealthy, but what they don't realize is that the difference between the middle and lower classes is a rounding error compared to the wealth of the upper class.

That's not anecdotal. You're playing mind reader to fit your own political agenda. That's pretty rude to your friends....if even that's true.

They also don't realize that a middle class Canadian has more disposable income than their southern equivalent, and yet Americans receives almost none of the free health care or other social safety nets

And once again, a Canadian doesn't understand that health care isn't free no matter how many times they say it.

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#34

Post by nickff » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 6:44 PM UTC

foobarian wrote: post #29

nickff wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't mean to nit-pick, but PAC money can come from foreign nationals if they have a 'green card'.

There is a contradiction in the rules. One rule says, 'permanent residents (green card holders) are OK' but then another says 'no foreign nationals.' I guess this could apply to the vanishingly small set of permanent residents who don't have a foreign citizenship anywhere.

Thanks for pointing this out. As far as I have seen, the rule has been applied so as to construe 'foreign nationals' as people who have neither US citizenship or permanent resident status. Basically, if you are entitled to the protections given by the Bill of Rights, you may donate to political campaigns.

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#35

Post by tinco » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 6:46 PM UTC

esbonsa wrote: post #22

zedadex wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? They're not shareholders, they're donors. Once money is donated to a Super PAC, it's the PAC's money to do with as they see fit. "PACs may make unlimited expenditures independently of a candidate or political party." Short of the agreement to match funds having extra stipulations (or Lessig putting those wealthy benefactors in charge of the PAC) there is nothing they can do about how the money gets spent.

Couldn't the donors agree to donate more if the PAC spends the already donated money in a certain way?

They could, but this PAC has only one goal, so the money either gets spend towards that goal or not. The donors would have to spend so much that everyone in the PAC organisation switches sides and goes for political ambition instead.

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#36

Post by dpweb » Sat, Jun 21, 2014, 8:40 PM UTC

pessimizer wrote: post #32

I need more words and less marketing to convince me to send my cash to people who have far more cash than I do. I need a very specific and very concrete explanation of what they plan to do with it. Is there a deeper link to documents with more detailed adult explanations of what they plan to do, how they plan to do it, and the specific criteria for support for a candidate? One that doesn't assume that I'm ignorant of…

It is completely explained on the site about the money.

1. Whatever is raised is matched by some well-off people who are willing to match.

2. They are raising $12m total

3. The money goes into selected campaigns where they have a good chance to turn the election and make the candidates support the reform agenda. They hire professionals who do this kind of thing.

4. None of the raised money is used for admin expenses.

5. If it works out, they continue into 2016 to turn more elections.

The question is, do people give a s*? Sadly, I'm pessimistic.. Drop $50 on this I'd say a pretty cheap lottery ticket considering how sick the system currently is..

Re: Steve Wozniak Endorses Lessig's Mayday Super PAC

#37

Post by pstop » Sun, Jun 22, 2014, 1:40 PM UTC

RichardFord wrote: post #33

pstop wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt it, Canadian here so I can't speak to the mumblings. All I can off is anecdotal information from talking to Americans when I'm down there, and the middle class don't understand how poor they are in America compared to their wealthy. They seem to feel that they're almost wealthy, but what they don't realize is that the difference between the middle and lower classes is a rounding error compared to the wealth o…

All I can off is anecdotal information from talking to Americans when I'm down there, and the middle class don't understand how poor they are in America compared to their wealthy. They seem to feel that they're almost wealthy, but what they don't realize is that the difference between the middle and lower classes is a rounding error compared to the wealth of the upper class. That's not anecdotal. You're playing mind…

Actually Richard, that's conversation. Americans who do not pursue more detailed of factual news get fed a lot of bullshit.

And when we're talking about disposable income, that means the income after taxes, comparable to Americans after taxes, the health care is FREE because it was covered in the taxes before to make the calculation. We also call it free, because it is free to use the services, not free of cost.