Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future? • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#31

Post by canweriotnow » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:01 AM UTC

gwu78 wrote: post #24

Why do you need to pay $25 in order to share code with your friends? Why can't someone wipe the phone's storage clean and install their own version of Android, or some other OS? Think back to the days before "smartphones", when your smallest computer was your laptop. Imagine if you had to pay Microsoft to be able to share a program you wrote with anyone else. Or if MS made it infeasible to remove Windows without maki…

You don't. It's $25 to publish on Google Play; you can share a *.apk with whomever you wish.

On iOS, on the other hand, it's $99/yr if you even want to run your own code on your own device. And you have to 'provision' your friends' devices if you want to share with them. It's extortion, it's stupid, it's immoral.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#32

Post by davidedicillo » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:03 AM UTC

canweriotnow wrote: post #28

bilbo0s wrote: post #16

So have the kids learn to code on Android. Problem solved. There is no "Obstacle to America's Future" here. The point is for every kid to learn to code... not for every kid to build a business publishing iPhone Apps. Why does it matter WHAT they code on??? I learned on an Apple II e, why? Because that's the computer that was donated to my school. It was old and haggared and no... my programs were not compatible with…

Problem solved, if kids have access to Android. Apple is aggressively pursuing the edu market, and seems to be winning there. This is antithetical to the "kids learning to code" ideal. I don't care what kids code on, I care about access. And forcing people to pay $99 to run their own code on their own devices is beyond unconscionable.

Google is aggressively pursuing the edu market with Chromebooks, so what?

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#33

Post by stephenr » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:04 AM UTC

canweriotnow wrote: post #28

bilbo0s wrote: post #16

So have the kids learn to code on Android. Problem solved. There is no "Obstacle to America's Future" here. The point is for every kid to learn to code... not for every kid to build a business publishing iPhone Apps. Why does it matter WHAT they code on??? I learned on an Apple II e, why? Because that's the computer that was donated to my school. It was old and haggared and no... my programs were not compatible with…

Problem solved, if kids have access to Android. Apple is aggressively pursuing the edu market, and seems to be winning there. This is antithetical to the "kids learning to code" ideal. I don't care what kids code on, I care about access. And forcing people to pay $99 to run their own code on their own devices is beyond unconscionable.

The $99 is to publish apps - I've made a couple of little quick fix utils for work projects by building and deploying straight to the phone via USB, no subscription required.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#34

Post by canweriotnow » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:04 AM UTC

bobbles wrote: post #3

bsirkia wrote: post #2

Interesting take. I'm curious how you respond to the counterpoints I usually hear to this argument: 1) Apple is creating a quality filter for $99, one that seems to be successful comparing the aggregate quality of apps on iOS vs. Android. 2) Yes, to test on your own device it's $99, but XCode is free and has all the simulators you need. If you're willing to build an entire app from scratch and invest that much time,…

They also provide extensive WWDC documentation and videos https://developer.apple.com/wwdc/videos/

^ I hope to Eris you're trolling.

Apple developer documentation? comp.os.linux was better documentation, in 1996.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#35

Post by davidedicillo » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:04 AM UTC

canweriotnow wrote: post #29

stbullard wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For that matter, write some HTML and JavaScript and make a thing that works on just about anything. Distribute it to your friends for free. "Coding" needn't be synonymous with native app development.

Yeah, but if you want to run that code on a device you own, why should you have to pay Apple a $99 ransom?

Good thing he didn't say "Build apps for your Playstation or xbox", you should see those ransoms...

Edit: Also, if you dad buys you a $500 phone, I'm sure he can spend $99 to for educational purposes.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#36

Post by shitlord » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:04 AM UTC

canweriotnow wrote: post #29

stbullard wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For that matter, write some HTML and JavaScript and make a thing that works on just about anything. Distribute it to your friends for free. "Coding" needn't be synonymous with native app development.

Yeah, but if you want to run that code on a device you own, why should you have to pay Apple a $99 ransom?

Well, if it's a web page, you don't.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#37

Post by canweriotnow » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:07 AM UTC

xdissent wrote: post #7

Article was poorly written lament from current android developer that wishes he was an iPhone dev but on principle doesn't have $100 to take his developed app to market. Overall, proud of Obama and I hope youth hears his call.

OP here, current iOS and Android developer with active accounts on both. Difference being: I'm happy to be an Android developer (will be happier when the Clojure/Android project reaches fruition); every time I have to dip my toes in Apple's filthy ichor of an app ecosystem I want to vomit.

Not about money for me, but if I was a little kid hacker again, money would have been a big deal.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#38

Post by peapicker » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:07 AM UTC

100 bucks isn't that much. My 13 yr old son has quadruple that saved up from odd jobs, chores, and gifts, and can't decide what to do with it. If he wanted to get a license for Apple Dev, it'd be no big whoop. Seriously, 100 ain't what it used to be.

(he's already bought an iPod touch using the same sources, and easily could use one of my Macs as the dev env)

Plus I have a RaspPi i bought for him to learn to code. He's picked up some Python so far...

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#39

Post by tga_d » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:07 AM UTC

bilbo0s wrote: post #16

So have the kids learn to code on Android. Problem solved. There is no "Obstacle to America's Future" here. The point is for every kid to learn to code... not for every kid to build a business publishing iPhone Apps. Why does it matter WHAT they code on??? I learned on an Apple II e, why? Because that's the computer that was donated to my school. It was old and haggared and no... my programs were not compatible with…

Isn't that the point that was being made? FTA:

... if we really care about the next generation becoming hackers and makers, not just consumers, we need to reject Apple’s bullshit, reject Micorsoft’s (decreasingly relevant) bullshit, and focus on open systems. This doesn’t have to be Android. Ubuntu Phone looks promising, Firefox OS might not be more Mozilla vaporware, and Jolla looks incredibly promising.

Re: Apple: The Obstacle to America's Future?

#40

Post by cageface » Tue, Dec 10, 2013, 6:08 AM UTC

I started coding on vintage Atari and Commodore PCs, where the first thing you saw after powering up your machine was a flashing cursor ready to accept basic code. The whole machine was an open slate, and it was easy to drop into assembly and call into the system directly.

Making coding this easy and this immediate was definitely an incentive to start hacking around and experimenting. Javascript + HTML hacking now is almost as easy but being able to hack the same hardware all your friends use as their main computing platform was cool. Now that mobile is becoming more and more the primary, if not only, way people interact with computers, the hackability of mobile platforms does matter.