Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video] • Hacker News Board

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#31

Post by gst » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:03 PM UTC

fat0wl wrote: post #22

Angostura wrote: post #21

Sounds to me as if Mr Branson has a bunch of Bitcoin and would like to cash-in early next week.

yeah the fact that the Bitcoin scam is spreading raises eyebrows. Companies want to accept it to sound futuristic but they should really be shutting it down. Notice how none of the tech-giants want to get involved with it. Bitcoin isn't for the technologically advanced who are "being rewarded for being sooooo smart and adopting early", it's a scammer platform. I heard a suggestion for a gold-backed digital currency o…

> The platform would never tank because people know roughly what it's worth.

So what exactly is the worth of one ounce of gold? The current market price? Or another price? What's the difference to Bitcoin in regards to pricing?

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#32

Post by fat0wl » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:03 PM UTC

VMG wrote: post #24

fat0wl wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah the fact that the Bitcoin scam is spreading raises eyebrows. Companies want to accept it to sound futuristic but they should really be shutting it down. Notice how none of the tech-giants want to get involved with it. Bitcoin isn't for the technologically advanced who are "being rewarded for being sooooo smart and adopting early", it's a scammer platform. I heard a suggestion for a gold-backed digital currency o…

> I heard a suggestion for a gold-backed digital currency once. I think you fell for a joke.

Think about it man, if the Bitcoin delusion ends it is worth nothing.

In a gold-backed online currency if it failed the users could just be beneficiaries of the trust. I'm not saying this is the ideal solution because I think maybe a completely fiat digital currency COULD work, just not with the Bitcoin scheme.

And I'm not saying Bitcoin can't work in the long-run. I'm saying it's not working NOW. It is not performing its intended function... unless that intended function is as a volatile speculator market.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#33

Post by drewblaisdell » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:05 PM UTC

fat0wl wrote: post #28

drewblaisdell wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Notice how none of the tech-giants want to get involved with it. Chamath Palihapitiya, Kevin Rose, the Winklevii

missing from that list -- Google, Yahoo, Amazon... actual retailers with products I don't care what VC hipsters are doing, and who the hell were the Winklevii before they started hyping bitcoin?

Google invested in Buttercoin (buttercoin.com).

You don't understand the virtual currency space. There are many good arguments against virtual currencies or bitcoin specifically, but the lack of Silicon Valley interest is absolutely not one of them.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#34

Post by fat0wl » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:05 PM UTC

user24 wrote: post #5

grey-area wrote: post #3

When businesses actually price products or services in a digital currency as opposed to accepting it, we'll know it has arrived and is ready to rival national currencies.

Agree. All these companies "accepting" bitcoin are actually just accepting USD and "converting" bitcoin.

Totally agreed -- they pretend to support the platform for the hipster cred & expanded market, but I'm sure the corporate policy is "Bitcoin arrives. Bitcoin is immediately placed on exchange".

I'd be surprised if corporations would gamble so dangerously by keeping a Bitcoin store. As long as they price against USD and convert immediately, they can only suffer limited losses from price swings.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#35

Post by triptychs » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:07 PM UTC

grey-area wrote: post #14

cs702 wrote: post #9

It seems that with every passing day, another prominent institution or business starts accepting Bitcoin for payment, Virgin Galactic being the latest example. In just a few years, Bitcoin has gone from experiment to global phenomenon. I wouldn't be surprised if in coming years at least some bitcoin users start measuring their wealth in bitcoins, and therefore also evaluating exchange rates, not in terms of how many…

Since the beginning of this year, the price of a US dollar has declined by more than 98%, from BTC 0.074 to just over BTC 0.001! Consider the last month: 2013-11-01 212.87 USD = 1 BTC 2013-11-22 733.71 USD = 1 BTC If you think Bitcoin is a great investment and can sell your BTC to get other assets in at a high point, this is a good thing, though slightly worrying because of the boom and bust pattern and extreme volat…

Just to comment on this part:

>I like the idea of a currency which doesn't allow politicians to introduce inflation, but perhaps we should have one which has a finite set of tokens on setup, and doesn't attempt to also attract people as some sort of investment with mining etc.

I'm sure someone will correct me, but as I understand it this is how Ripple[0] works. From my recollection (I haven't checked in on how Ripple has been progressing over the past 6-8 months or so), Ripple's currency (XRP) are established with a finite supply and all XRP is in reserve, not requiring any "mining" or similar. Also, it looks like Ripple is kind of an exchange as well? It seems to be able to cross-process payments between USD, EUR, BTC, LTC, XRP, and more (I believe most international currencies are supported currently)[1]. It's interesting but, like I said earlier, I'm not sure if I fully understand it.

[0] https://ripple.com/ [1] https://ripple.com/guide-to-currency-trading-on-the-ripple-n...

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#36

Post by nilkn » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:11 PM UTC

lambda wrote: post #30

cs702 wrote: post #9

It seems that with every passing day, another prominent institution or business starts accepting Bitcoin for payment, Virgin Galactic being the latest example. In just a few years, Bitcoin has gone from experiment to global phenomenon. I wouldn't be surprised if in coming years at least some bitcoin users start measuring their wealth in bitcoins, and therefore also evaluating exchange rates, not in terms of how many…

No, the volatility has been entirely in BTC. Volatility should more accurately be measured against actual real-world goods that you can buy. Since pretty much all actual goods are priced in currencies other than BTC, with the BTC price merely set based on the current exchange rate with the currency that the goods are bought at, it's BTC that's volatile, not the USD. This kind of volatility is actually really harmful…

> It's pretty dumb to actually spend bitcoins if you could just hold onto them

A similar question can be asked about USD: why would you ever save it instead of spending it immediately, since it's only going to lose value over time due to inflation?

Of course, the difference right now is that the deflation rate in bitcoin is much higher than the inflation rate in USD. But clearly, if bitcoin ever becomes a major currency and the deflation levels off, there will be plenty of motivation to spend bitcoins, the same way there is currently plenty of motivation to save USD.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#37

Post by jerguismi » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:13 PM UTC

grey-area wrote: post #3

When businesses actually price products or services in a digital currency as opposed to accepting it, we'll know it has arrived and is ready to rival national currencies.

I don't see pricing as significant goal with Bitcoin. Other currencies can be used for pricing. I use bitcoin myself, and never by from stores which price the goods in Bitcoin, because they are most certainly rip-off prices. The good way is to price in fiat, then use something like bitpay exchange rate at checkout.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#38

Post by drewblaisdell » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:14 PM UTC

user24 wrote: post #5

grey-area wrote: post #3

When businesses actually price products or services in a digital currency as opposed to accepting it, we'll know it has arrived and is ready to rival national currencies.

Agree. All these companies "accepting" bitcoin are actually just accepting USD and "converting" bitcoin.

... with a much smaller fee than if they simply accepted USD.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#39

Post by fat0wl » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:14 PM UTC

drewblaisdell wrote: post #33

fat0wl wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

missing from that list -- Google, Yahoo, Amazon... actual retailers with products I don't care what VC hipsters are doing, and who the hell were the Winklevii before they started hyping bitcoin?

Google invested in Buttercoin (buttercoin.com). You don't understand the virtual currency space. There are many good arguments against virtual currencies or bitcoin specifically, but the lack of Silicon Valley interest is absolutely not one of them.

It's not that I am against virtual currency and think there is no interest in it -- I just think the Bitcoin scheme is so f__ked that respected corps don't wanna be involved.

I'm not surprised at all that Google invested in an alternative. In fact, maybe that will catalyze Bitcoin's demise.

Re: Virgin Galactic to accept Bitcoin [video]

#40

Post by lambda » Fri, Nov 22, 2013, 5:17 PM UTC

nilkn wrote: post #36

lambda wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the volatility has been entirely in BTC. Volatility should more accurately be measured against actual real-world goods that you can buy. Since pretty much all actual goods are priced in currencies other than BTC, with the BTC price merely set based on the current exchange rate with the currency that the goods are bought at, it's BTC that's volatile, not the USD. This kind of volatility is actually really harmful…

> It's pretty dumb to actually spend bitcoins if you could just hold onto them A similar question can be asked about USD: why would you ever save it instead of spending it immediately, since it's only going to lose value over time due to inflation? Of course, the difference right now is that the deflation rate in bitcoin is much higher than the inflation rate in USD. But clearly, if bitcoin ever becomes a major curre…

Because it loses value slowly enough. That's the whole "stability" part. Holding onto USD for a year or two doesn't lose a significant amount of value, so you can save up effectively and plan on what you will be able to buy with it at the end. And you can put it in an interest bearing bank account or invest it to further offset or counteract the effect of inflation for longer-term savings.

Unstable currencies you generally need to convert to a more stable currency immediately, if you don't want to be subject to the sudden swings in value.