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CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

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Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#31

Post by anon1385 »

harshreality wrote: post #28
anon1385 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even the existence of direct and easy to understand causal links doesn't prevent corporate disinformation campaigns if there is money involved. Just look at the history of tobacco propaganda. Cato is still feeding the media articles and quotes denying that there are health risks from second hand smoke. If you want to find an industry where antibiotics crate large profit then look at industrial farming.

What percentage of antibiotics used in industrial animal farms are still patented, and what's the profit margin and net profit from those antibiotics at biotech companies?

Farms use the majority of antibiotics: http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2011/07/what-usda-do...

Altogether, the US meat industry uses 29 million pounds of antibiotics every year. To put that number in perspective, consider that we humans in the United States—in all of our prescription fill-ups and hospital stays combined—use just over 7 million pounds per year. Thus the vast bulk of antibiotics consumed in this country, some 80 percent, goes to factory animal farms.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#32

Post by 3pt14159 »

alan_cx wrote: post #23

Why is it that some apocalyptic scientific predictions are accepted, while others gain a culture of denial? Strikes me that one could construct a counter argument against this prediction which is as strong as the arguments, for example, climate change deniers use. Yet, no one has done so. I'm struggling to imagine why. Is there profit for the current big players in solving this issue, where as climate change solution…

Why? Because some things are testable. Antibiotics can be tested in a lab, while climate science cannot. Furthermore the climate is not behaving like early models predicted it would, so it makes it hard for people to accept (especially after sensationalist movies like An Inconvenient Truth). Also the politics involved are complex. Some countries (like my Canada) use way more oil per person and wouldn't be as affected by climate change.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#33

Post by aluhut »

I grew up in a former East Block country. Back then we had medical centers. If you were sick, you went there and they gave you something. Most of the time the solution was: Antibiotics. Because I was sick quite often, I can say I grew up on Antibiotics. When we moved to West Europe my mother made the mistake of chosing a doctor from our country (so she could uderstand what she says). So I continued to get antibiotics until I got an bronchitis. Two weeks had passed until the doctor decided it was a bronchitis and not "just" one of my usual sick-phases (that she also treated with antibiotics). I spend additional two weeks getting more of the same antibiotic. It got worse. Finaly she decided that it may be useful to make an radiographic examination. Lucily the doctor there realised that I had pneumonia and changed my medication.

I have not been to a doctor for over 20 years since. I did not take anything besides some aspirine when I hit my head skiing 8 years ago. I don't know how this is possible after my very hard childhood but I just don't get sick anymore.

I am very sure that I'll not make the same mistake of letting the doctors solve everything with the hammer when my children get sick.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#34

Post by r0h1n »

velodrome wrote: post #4

People need stop using antibiotics for everything and use it only when necessary. When Drugs Stop Working-Norway's Answer: http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-205_162-6014559.html

> Norwegians are sanguine about their coughs and colds, toughing it out through low-grade infections.

> "We don't throw antibiotics at every person with a fever. We tell them to hang on, wait and see, and we give them a Tylenol to feel better," says Haug.

I wish more of us would follow this approach and learn to accept being 'sick' for a few days (or even a week) every now and then.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#35

Post by indrax »

alan_cx wrote: post #23

Why is it that some apocalyptic scientific predictions are accepted, while others gain a culture of denial? Strikes me that one could construct a counter argument against this prediction which is as strong as the arguments, for example, climate change deniers use. Yet, no one has done so. I'm struggling to imagine why. Is there profit for the current big players in solving this issue, where as climate change solution…

I'll guess it's because the apocalyptic threat is something direct and personal that we have aversion to.

It's "People get sick and the medicines don't work" or worse, YOU get sick and the medicines don't work. It's a simple, easy to imagine situation.

Climate change effects don't have the same combination of simple, personal, accurate, and bad.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#36

Post by stephnexus »

Agree that antibiotics need to be withheld from livestock unless they are actually sick. Our conventional food system practices are a disgusting joke.

On the innovative side, I wish more research were ongoing with regard to bacteriophages:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phage_therapy

This therapy pre-dates antibiotics but is harder to target to the pathogen. Russia has been using phages for decades.

Other options include natural antibiotics, like manuka honey, which is already being used (as "MediHoney") by hospitals in the U.S. when other antibiotics fail. My main question is: Why is this end-of-line therapy, when it has few to no side effects and it's more difficult for bacteria to develop resistance to it (since it's a multifaceted natural compound, instead of a single-strategy synthetic compound)?

Answer: profit. But it's time for us to evolve. And evolution in this case doesn't necessarily mean more high-tech -- we're low-tech organisms, it's quite possible that the solution is also low-tech.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#37

Post by colmvp »

route66 wrote: post #18
colmvp wrote: post #2

Has there been any research to indicate that antibiotics in livestock gets passed to humans (and if so, to what degree)? I know that there was testimony by Dr. Lance B. Price to the House Committee for greater transparency on "why, how and in what animals these vital drugs are used." http://democrats.energycommerce.house.gov/sites/default/file...

As a challenge a Dutch research: http://www.vwa.nl/onderwerpen/risicobeoordelingen/bestand/22... From the abstract (freely translated): "... guessed is that a third to half of resistance encountered in germs within humans is of agricultural origin." Important is that not the antibiotics are transferred from animals to humans but the already resistant bacteria. A short summary is here: http://www.upi.com/Science_News/…

Awesome, thank you.

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#38

Post by fudge »

velodrome wrote: post #4

People need stop using antibiotics for everything and use it only when necessary. When Drugs Stop Working-Norway's Answer: http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-205_162-6014559.html

Two weeks ago a doctor lost his license here in Norway due to long term, high dosage antibiotic usage: http://translate.google.no/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&pre...

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#39

Post by cafard »

velodrome wrote: post #4

People need stop using antibiotics for everything and use it only when necessary. When Drugs Stop Working-Norway's Answer: http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-205_162-6014559.html

My chief complaint about the GP we used to go to was that she was fond of saying "Well, it's probably viral, but here's some xyz just in case."

Re: CDC Threat Report: ‘We Will Soon Be in a Post-Antibiotic Era’

#40

Post by leoedin »

stephnexus wrote: post #36

Agree that antibiotics need to be withheld from livestock unless they are actually sick. Our conventional food system practices are a disgusting joke. On the innovative side, I wish more research were ongoing with regard to bacteriophages: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phage_therapy This therapy pre-dates antibiotics but is harder to target to the pathogen. Russia has been using phages for decades. Other options inclu…

The issue isn't just that antibiotics are used routinely for animals. The issue is that high volume (and low cost) animal rearing techniques require extensive antibiotic use to compensate for the awful conditions and diet of the animals. Legislating against antibiotic use in animals would definitely help though.
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