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Teenagers and the Internet

theguardian.com

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Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#31

Post by nissimk »

3pt14159 wrote: post #11

I've had the internet for twenty years (since I was 8) and computer access since I was 3. Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Some kids who have poor role models are going to ask for oral sex from boys or girls that like them. This was true 3000 years ago. It is true today. It will be true twenty years from now regardless of what silly idea the person who made the documentary h…

I'm very upset that this is the top comment on here. 14 year old teenagers are definitely children and they do need to be protected by law from predators. Just because they are old enough to have children of their own doesn't make them adults. Is not OK for sites or individuals to be collecting sexual images of children and distributing them.

Also, to all you folks on here saying that this is all fear mongering to take away or rights, you're missing the larger point here which is that the recent cultural shift with the prevalence of handheld computing has a lot of negative side effects and we need to rethink the norms. It is very rude to sit at the dinner table with people and be interacting with your mobile device rather than your real life companions. It wouldn't have been OK for a parent to sit at the dinner table having a phone call with colleagues back then and just because mobile Internet makes it silent it's still not OK.

That is just one example in a long list of things related to mobile computing that are considered OK but are actually rude or unhealthy.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#32

Post by smackay »

The only practical approach is to give teenagers the tools necessary to deal with this and make sensible decisions based on their own values and respect for others (as if being a teenager wasn't hard enough already). However, good luck in getting PE (Porn Education) taught to ten-year olds, never mind being able to filter out all the agendas of concerned parties and being able to create the materials necessary with essentially nothing to base it on - in terms of the effects it's having on teenagers development.

The ship of consequences sailed a long time ago on this one and it's not clear where it's headed.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#33

Post by Cthulhu_ »

msluyter wrote: post #27

Given the absence of real data (as in, studies that demonstrate conclusively that watching too much online porn has certain downsides), it's not surprising that a lot of comments are resorting to anecdotal reasoning of the form: "Well, I use the internet and I'm ok..." Nonetheless, I think it's worth entertaining the hypothesis that in many ways the internet is like candy for your brain, and constant exposure might h…

> Nonetheless, I think it's worth entertaining the hypothesis that in many ways the internet is like candy for your brain, and constant exposure might have subtle -- perhaps not yet fully recognized or appreciated -- effects on our cognition.

It does, actually. Read Nicholas Carr's 'The Shallows' [0], it's a pretty decent book about the subject. It also starts off with comparing our usage of the internet with the rise of reading - you know, books and the like. History lesson; humans needed to adapt their brains to be able to read attentively for longer periods of time. The book contrasts that with the ADD nature of the internet, and yet, indicates how it's actually going back to where we were before. Or just a change similar to when books became publicly accessible.

tl;dr, yes there is a change, but I don't think it's necessarily good or bad; just different. And shocking / to be resisted by the older generation, just as how their parents were shocked and resisting the Beatles and similar long-haired freaks. :p

[0]: http://www.amazon.com/The-Shallows-Internet-Doing-Brains/dp/...

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#34

Post by shortlived »

msluyter wrote: post #27

Given the absence of real data (as in, studies that demonstrate conclusively that watching too much online porn has certain downsides), it's not surprising that a lot of comments are resorting to anecdotal reasoning of the form: "Well, I use the internet and I'm ok..." Nonetheless, I think it's worth entertaining the hypothesis that in many ways the internet is like candy for your brain, and constant exposure might h…

Do we need real data to know that too much porn is a bad thing?

> The problem is that these are the same sorts of arguments > that have been deployed in the face of every technological > advance

I agree and at the risk of sounding like my parents, I think the internet is different. Never before has their been a technology so all encompassing and so powerful (and dangerous).

If I wanted to look at pictures of girls when I was a horny teen, I had the bra section of the JC Penny catalog. The jump from that to the type of online porn that exists today is pretty big. Add to the fact that online porn is so much more accessible than visiting a porno shop, it's no wonder kids can fall into it more easily.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#35

Post by Cthulhu_ »

acallaghan wrote: post #9
djent wrote: post #4

I'm a teenager, and from my own experience, teenagers will do idiotic things even without the Internet. Pointing the finger at the Internet for parents' problems with their children is an easy thing to do because the Internet can't defend itself, especially as a whole.

In the 60's the teenager label emerged. These were just kids that had found a sense of community in sharing music, rebellion against the system, and unique dress. There's nothing new here. Teenagers will be rebellious, as they always have. If the older people in society find ways to prevent them from accessing material they want to see, they'll just find another way. Teenagers have their own tastes in what the intern…

And yet, before the 60's and before the rise of proper education, teenagers went to work after elementary school (if that) and became mature, responsible adults much sooner. At least, so I heard. They couldn't get together and have orgies or whatever, because they were expected to be either at work, or back at work at 6 AM.

[/faux history teacher]

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#36

Post by hackula1 »

3pt14159 wrote: post #11

I've had the internet for twenty years (since I was 8) and computer access since I was 3. Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Some kids who have poor role models are going to ask for oral sex from boys or girls that like them. This was true 3000 years ago. It is true today. It will be true twenty years from now regardless of what silly idea the person who made the documentary h…

14-15 is prepubescent for many individuals. Definitely children.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#37

Post by barry-cotter »

ttt_ wrote: post #23
3pt14159 wrote: post #11

I've had the internet for twenty years (since I was 8) and computer access since I was 3. Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Some kids who have poor role models are going to ask for oral sex from boys or girls that like them. This was true 3000 years ago. It is true today. It will be true twenty years from now regardless of what silly idea the person who made the documentary h…

>> Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Much akin to "when we were kids we rode in the front seat without seat belts on, we turned out fine", and several other versions of that phrase. I don't think it's a valid argument at all.

I fail to see why I should take your feeling driven anecdote backed position over your interlocutor's feeling driven anecdote backed position.

I watched all the porn I could get my hands on and turned out fine is evidence. It's not conclusive or anything but you wouldn't see it in a world where porn was the devil. The below articles certainly don't support demonisation of porn.

http://maggiemcneill.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/pornography...

http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/1961to1999/1999-p...

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#38

Post by barrkel »

nissimk wrote: post #31
3pt14159 wrote: post #11

I've had the internet for twenty years (since I was 8) and computer access since I was 3. Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Some kids who have poor role models are going to ask for oral sex from boys or girls that like them. This was true 3000 years ago. It is true today. It will be true twenty years from now regardless of what silly idea the person who made the documentary h…

I'm very upset that this is the top comment on here. 14 year old teenagers are definitely children and they do need to be protected by law from predators. Just because they are old enough to have children of their own doesn't make them adults. Is not OK for sites or individuals to be collecting sexual images of children and distributing them. Also, to all you folks on here saying that this is all fear mongering to ta…

I think part of the problem is this binary label of children | not-children, which then gives rise to infantilizing treatment.

The post you're responding to was splitting the spectrum into at least three parts, children | teenagers | adults, while you're arguing for children | adults - or at least that's how it looks. But I think you're on the wrong track there. Something that is closer to modelling a spectrum is better than a binary distinction, and is less likely to give rise to asinine laws / enforcement, like prosecuting teenagers for self-production of child porn.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#39

Post by orf »

3pt14159 wrote: post #11

I've had the internet for twenty years (since I was 8) and computer access since I was 3. Most of my friends had access since they were 10 or 11. We turned out fine. Some kids who have poor role models are going to ask for oral sex from boys or girls that like them. This was true 3000 years ago. It is true today. It will be true twenty years from now regardless of what silly idea the person who made the documentary h…

Free and unlimited access to hardcore pornography of any type when you are in your early teens is relatively new. No generation has been exposed to such a stream of heavily sexualized content before, both online and offline.

I mean the porn of 50 years ago seems tame by todays standards. Exposing children to such adult themes before they have even fully developed can't be a good thing.

Re: Teenagers and the Internet

#40

Post by jdlegg »

msluyter wrote: post #27

Given the absence of real data (as in, studies that demonstrate conclusively that watching too much online porn has certain downsides), it's not surprising that a lot of comments are resorting to anecdotal reasoning of the form: "Well, I use the internet and I'm ok..." Nonetheless, I think it's worth entertaining the hypothesis that in many ways the internet is like candy for your brain, and constant exposure might h…

I think the most concrete example of what you're describing is the "pattern" we saw with tobacco. Science suggested for a long time that cigarette smoking might be bad for you. As the evidence grew stronger, tobacco companies ran ads with Joe DiMaggio about how healthy their brand was[1].

Eventually the evidence was so irrefutable, and there were enough "casualties," that most reasonable people were forced to accept it.

This seems like a pattern that repeats itself. It begins with anecdotal evidence, followed by a long period of scientific research, then propaganda campaigns and eventual acceptance.

We're currently seeing it, about halfway through the curve, in the food industry with sugar. It's also happened previously with lead, seatbelts, asbestos, gambling, mercury, alcohol & driving, cholesterol, tanning booths, etc.

And now, perhaps, it's starting on the effect of information consumption. I use the term "information consumption" because it seems to be about much more than just teenagers and their phones.

[1] http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6149/6012309554_2c177196a8_z.j...

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