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'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

theguardian.com

31–40 of 55 posts

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#31
post #6
post #2

Hopefully this thread won't degenerate into anti-transgender comments like so many others today. Obviously Manning has needed mental health treatment for quite some time. Hopefully he can get what he needs while in prison. It's just too bad that prison is where he has to go to get help.

I don't see how the taxpayers should pay for this. One of the reasons the comments are so negative is because it feels like a smokescreen and/or a last attempt at sympathy. I don't care if he wants to become a girl, but he should wait until his/her time is served. I wonder if military prisons are monitored/protected any better than civilian prisons when it comes to that 'other' stuff.

> I don't see how the taxpayers should pay for this [...] I don't care if he wants to become a girl, but he should wait until his/her time is served.

Gender identity disorder / gender dysphoria is a genuine medical condition classified in the DSM (IV and V). For many sufferers it is not a matter of simple "wanting" to change their gender.

If you accept that gender dysphoria is a medical condition (as most in the medical and mental health professions have), then the question becomes "should prisoners receive treatment for it?"

I would argue that yes, they should. But I live in a country with socialised medicine, where healthcare is provided to all free of charge (including treatment for gender dysphoria). In my mind, being imprisoned deprives you of liberty, but not the right to free healthcare. I imagine many people in America would feel differently - "why", they might say, "should a prisoner get treated for free when I can't afford my own medical bills?".

That said, it's not totally clear to me that taxpayers would be paying for Chelsea Manning's treatment? I couldn't find any reference to it in her letter, merely that she hopes to begin hormone treatment shortly.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#32
post #5

Seriously we have to do something about that type of articles making the front page of hacker news. It's getting out of hand lately.

Why? They make the front page because people view and up-vote them. People are clearly interested in them...

It's a new story, and gender dysphoria is a topic that I think is well worth discussing.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#33
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how the taxpayers should pay for this. One of the reasons the comments are so negative is because it feels like a smokescreen and/or a last attempt at sympathy. I don't care if he wants to become a girl, but he should wait until his/her time is served. I wonder if military prisons are monitored/protected any better than civilian prisons when it comes to that 'other' stuff.

s/he/she s/his/her

Seen your "nickpickiness" leads to no other conclusion: you are homosexual, are you?

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#34
post #29
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense. His point of view is that a women is not what he wants to become, but what he is. He just wants to be recognized as one. Also, I don't really see where there is spending involved. Even if there were, the amount would be insignificant to even care about. There is much more waste elsewhere in the system. Last but not least, this guy shouldn't even be serving the sentence he is.

That's not what I'm arguing against, I'm stating that hormone therapy should not be paid for by the military. That said, if he wants to be recognized as a woman, that means he wants to be placed in prison with other women, which is clearly an issue. IMO the military has no choice but to place him in a male facility and call him whatever he wants to be called.

[deleted]

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#35
post #25
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manning preferred to be female well before the leaks or the trial. Also, the Army/taxpayers are paying for Manning's housing, food, clothes, and therapy even outside of prison.

Typically, they would not provide hormone therapy because a) it is not essential for the job (they pull teeth instead of fix them for crying out loud) b) this is typically something that would lead to a medical discharge and in some cases, dishonorable discharge because it wasn't listed in the health questionnaire at time of application.

Sorry, I got my articles confused. According to http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/08/22/convict... Leavenworth provides psychiatric therapy but not hormone therapy. I'm not sure where Manning is hoping to get it, but it's not clear that it's going to be taxpayer-funded.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#36
post #32
post #5

Seriously we have to do something about that type of articles making the front page of hacker news. It's getting out of hand lately.

Why? They make the front page because people view and up-vote them. People are clearly interested in them... It's a new story, and gender dysphoria is a topic that I think is well worth discussing.

Sure, look at the quality of the comments in this thread. Truly enlightening. I'm sure we've all learned a lot on gender dysphoria.

This is tabloid material.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/he/she s/his/her

Seen your "nickpickiness" leads to no other conclusion: you are homosexual, are you?

Homosexuality and gender identity aren't the same thing...

I find these (spammy) posts annoying also, but what does his/her orientation have to do with anything?

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#38
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/he/she

Can you stop doing this all over the thread? If you have a point to make, make it, but this is just spam.

The message(s) are the point. Misgendering people isn't nice, especially after someone has specifically laid out how they wish to be addressed. But yes, I will conceed I have been a little spammy and probably could have gone about it with less.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#39
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/he/she

Doing this repeatedly is likely to get you automatically hellbanned. A comment on this at the root level will probably get enough upvotes to bring it near the top.

Thanks for the heads up.

Re: 'I am Chelsea Manning,' says jailed soldier formerly known as Bradley

#40
post #32
post #5

Seriously we have to do something about that type of articles making the front page of hacker news. It's getting out of hand lately.

Why? They make the front page because people view and up-vote them. People are clearly interested in them... It's a new story, and gender dysphoria is a topic that I think is well worth discussing.

>It's a new story, and gender dysphoria is a topic that I think is well worth discussing.

It's hacker news, not the comments section of deviantart.

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