It doesn't really sound like a job I'd like to do, but I would imagine it compares favourably with the other jobs available for unskilled workers - supermarket checkouts, building site labourer, care assistant etc etc.
Amazon Unpacked
31–40 of 68 posts
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#32I wonder how long it takes for such jobs to be fully robot-staffed. I had the impression it's already the case for some types of warehouse tasks. With very high likeness, within our lifetime there will be no need for human pac-mans.
And what are the chances that the packers who are complaining now, will be complaining then that their jobs were taken away and they want it back? Pretty damn high, I'd say.
If all you're given to drink is dirty water, and you complain about it, that doesn't mean you want nothing to drink. It means you want something better to drink.
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#33I wonder how long it takes for such jobs to be fully robot-staffed. I had the impression it's already the case for some types of warehouse tasks. With very high likeness, within our lifetime there will be no need for human pac-mans.
Amazon bought a company called Kiva Systems that builds warehousing systems where robots bring the shelving units to the human packers. It's really neat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWsMdN7HMuA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiva_Systems
So essentially this system eliminates the up to 15 miles of walking that each worker does per day. Amazon paid $775m for Kiva, and the cost of fitting out each warehouse with the Kiva system can't be cheap... The cost to pay an army of people to walk 15 miles per day must add up real quick!
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#34Interesting article, sounds like a horrendous place to work by all accounts. The technique of using temp agencies for the bulk of a workforce is very common in the States from what I understand, ensuring employees have few rights. Hopefully it doesn't become prevalent here in the UK.
Sadly it's already common in the UK, and not just for big firms with seasonal variations - local councils (for example) are looking for an out-sourced employee 'bank' that can be easily adjusted with fewer headaches. Recent changes in employment law for temporary workers may help, but may also lead to more cynical manipulation (e.g. replace all temporary staff before they become eligible for higher status...).
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#35We've gotten to a point where those who read this article will say sweatshop labor is OK because we want our 2-day free shipping. Then, we say it isn't OK because they make minimum-wage, have to walk 15 miles a day, and work under management that runs the shop by strict metrics. Well, someone has to do it (at least now.. coming soon: robots) - not everyone is destined to goto college or even a voc-tech school to lear…
Mining paid a lot better than pick&pack.
Yes, and made a huge loss as well.
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#36I work in a distribution center (not one of Amazon's and not on the floor). What they're describing in the article is pretty much industry standard for non-robotic picking. It's a very difficult and demanding job and we're very up front about that. People take the job figuring they can sling a few boxes and a large percent leave within their probationary period because they underestimate the work no matter how much y…
The walking part of it was one of the things that jumped out at me. 15 miles is a hike. To do that every day on concrete would tear you up.
Since you work at such a place, what is the feasibility of motorized "scooter carts", that you could ride on, perhaps standing up, as you go from location to location?
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#37We've gotten to a point where those who read this article will say sweatshop labor is OK because we want our 2-day free shipping. Then, we say it isn't OK because they make minimum-wage, have to walk 15 miles a day, and work under management that runs the shop by strict metrics. Well, someone has to do it (at least now.. coming soon: robots) - not everyone is destined to goto college or even a voc-tech school to lear…
> Mining (...) sucks worse than an Amazon warehouse I'm not sure. Yes, mining was physically one of the most demanding / intense work there has ever been -- see this fantastic description by Orwell for example: http://george-orwell.org/Down_The_Mine/0.html But, in a way, it that was a good thing, because you did a job most other humans weren't capable of doing.
I wonder which has a greater life expectancy and quality: workers who have to walk several miles a day in a clean warehouse, or workers who (ignoring the more immediate occupational hazards...) spend their careers breathing coal and silica dust.
Of course mining sucks more than warehouse work... it kills you slowly.
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#38At the end of each day, in a University town, you might sit down to enjoy a meal or a cup of coffee at a local café, and strike up a conversation with a complete stranger. The two of you might find quite a lot to talk about, trading ideas and perspectives on different subjects, and ideas would flow between you, like heat from a hot cup of coffee into cold hands. But in a one-shop town (like the one I grew up in, or t…
" But in a one-shop town (like the one I grew up in, or the one in this story), at the end of the day, what do these hard working people have to talk about?"
Family, sports, national or local politics, world events, movies come to mind. A lot of people are fine with walking out the door at 5 pm and leaving work behind.
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#39It's funny how a job like this fits with the cultural idea of 'the dignity of work.' The politicians and Amazon describe the human-robot job in positive terms, like they're helping the community. But the real way jobs help people is by providing them with enough resources to improve their situation, and gain control of their lives. Working in an Amazon factory doesn't do that. First, after hustling for 15 miles a shi…
First, after hustling for 15 miles a shift making minimum wage, you aren't going to be able to return to your shelter and work on a skill or education. You'd have to eat and sleep and recover.
Walking for 7-15 miles, spread over an 8 hour day, is not actually all that strenuous. It's worse than an office job, but it's pretty light exercise. In terms of calories burned, it's about double a typical boxing workout (roughly 1000 cals for boxing, 2000 for walking 16 miles@2mph), which is something I do every morning before going to an office job. In terms of intensity it's about 4x less (2x the work / 8x the time).
So figure 8 hours/day at work, another hour commuting, 8 hours sleeping, that's 7 hours/day to do whatever you want. (Hint: skip the TV, learn a skill.)
Re: Amazon Unpacked
#40I'm surprised at the amount of negativity here.
It's work.
As demonstrated in the article some of these people were surely just subsisting on unemployment prior.
My first job wasn't near-minimum wage, it was the absolute minimum. I didn't have work-issued safety boots to complain about, I had to buy my own. I didn't walk around a clean warehouse, I walked around outside cleaning up after every kind of urban nastiness you can imagine regardless of the weather. I wouldn't have even considered missing work in the first week for anything that didn't have me fearing for my life, let alone blisters. There was effectively no chance of being made permanent.
I was happy as hell to have that job. It changed my life and I used the small comfort it provided to study up and find my way into better things. I'd have been overjoyed to do the kind of work described in this article.
There are certainly a lot of idealistic ways these jobs "should" be, but in reality I think the idea of treating this work as anything but a temporary (for the workers and in general in light of automation) stepping stone is fantasy.