How to know when someone is in trouble in the water • Hacker News Board

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#31

Post by antoko » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 4:57 PM UTC

clarkmoody wrote: post #11

antoko wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

did you mean to contradict the article or did you not even read it? Throughout the Instinctive Drowning Response, drowning people cannot voluntarily control their arm movements. Physiologically, drowning people who are struggling on the surface of the water cannot stop drowning and perform voluntary movements such as waving for help, moving toward a rescuer, or reaching out for a piece of rescue equipment.

I've had water rescue training. I read the article as well. Parent comment was addressing a drowning person victimizing the rescuer, which also seems to contradict the article.

You're right - I'm making assumptions when imagining the situations described in my head and jumping to unfair conclusions about your point.

When I imagine a person in the water trying to help it seems obvious that if you're next to them in the water they will clamber on to you and do whatever they can to keep their mouth out of the water to breathe.

When I image holding some object out for them to grab it seems the greater chance is that they wont be aware of the object, or unable to reach the object.

However a rescuer with actual knowledge would be aware of the situation and would ensure they physically touch them with the object so they have to be aware of it.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#32

Post by b0rsuk » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:01 PM UTC

clarkmoody wrote: post #28

b0rsuk wrote: post #13

"""How did this captain know—from 50 feet away—what the father couldn’t recognize from just 10? Drowning is not the violent, splashing call for help that most people expect. The captain was trained to recognize drowning by experts and years of experience. The father, on the other hand, had learned what drowning looks like by watching television. (...) Drowning is almost always a deceptively quiet event.""" I think th…

You would need a much more comprehensive overview process to eliminate misleading information from movies, even if it were limited to life-threatening misinformation! One instance I can think of is MRI magnets. Often, a medical drama will cut to someone pushing a button and the magnet coming on. In reality, the magnets are always on and bringing metal objects within range can have dire consequences. The whole movie H…

At least in the case of Home Alone, actors show signs of pain and even injury. From there it's a matter of magnitude. In case of drowning, it's the difference between nothing happening and someone dying. Not someone drowning slightly.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#33

Post by nsxwolf » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:01 PM UTC

A video would be helpful. I'm not confident I could recognize all those signs from the descriptions.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#34

Post by mcclung » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:02 PM UTC

mikeryan wrote: post #20

ender7 wrote: post #6

Beware: it is very dangerous to attempt to rescue a full-grown person who is drowning. A person who is drowning has temporarily lost their mind and will happily drown their would-be rescuer in an attempt to stay above the water. Approach a drowning person from behind and hold them above the water by their armpits.

Approach a drowning person from behind and hold them above the water by their armpits Unless you're a trained lifeguard this is poor advice. As stated above you don't want to get within touching/grabbing distance of a drowning person. Get some sort of intermediary between you and them, a stick, rope, shirt, pants whatever. Something that you can drop if you are at risk. To the point below about their instincts of not…

I had a lady next to me start to drown and grab me in a pool when I was getting my diving certification. Despite having a supply of air, wetsuit, fins and buoyancy control device on, she got that drowning sensation when her respirator came out. Once she had someone to hold onto, sanity was restored but I totally got why drowning people are dangerous from then on.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#35

Post by b0rsuk » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:04 PM UTC

mikeash wrote: post #30

clarkmoody wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would need a much more comprehensive overview process to eliminate misleading information from movies, even if it were limited to life-threatening misinformation! One instance I can think of is MRI magnets. Often, a medical drama will cut to someone pushing a button and the magnet coming on. In reality, the magnets are always on and bringing metal objects within range can have dire consequences. The whole movie H…

Banning the portrayal of drivers looking at their passengers while talking to them would probably save more lives than banning inaccurate portrayals of drowning.

Fine, let's do both. I can't think a of valid reason the driver should be looking at passengers while talking (I mean, not in the mirror).

The law could really just affect swimming and driving. Both activities are common and can result in death if you're not careful.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#36

Post by hluska » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:04 PM UTC

parfe wrote: post #7

hluska wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious...let's say that you see someone drowning, you aren't a trained lifeguard, and there aren't any lifeguards around. Could an untrained person rescue that person safely? Any tips?

First, the primary job for any rescuer is to not become another victim. Be prepared for a violent altercation with the victim. The person is dying and not thinking normally. Don't be afraid to hurt the person to protect yourself. If the situation is too much, back off and wait for the victim to lose consciousness. Pulling a drowning person from the water takes more than just strong swimming. And again, I was only the…

Thanks very much for taking the time to answer this - I feel better knowing more!!

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#37

Post by ivank » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:05 PM UTC

dspeyer wrote: post #16

color: rgb(102,102,102) Seriously? Why do so many publishers make their content so hard to read? (Once I fixed that with inspectElement, the article was good.)

I'm guessing this happens when a designer has a bright LCD screen and thinks black on white has too much contrast.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#38

Post by clarkmoody » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:06 PM UTC

mikeash wrote: post #30

clarkmoody wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would need a much more comprehensive overview process to eliminate misleading information from movies, even if it were limited to life-threatening misinformation! One instance I can think of is MRI magnets. Often, a medical drama will cut to someone pushing a button and the magnet coming on. In reality, the magnets are always on and bringing metal objects within range can have dire consequences. The whole movie H…

Banning the portrayal of drivers looking at their passengers while talking to them would probably save more lives than banning inaccurate portrayals of drowning.

Correct. However, drowning is high on the list[1] of common causes of injury death for children. Vehicle accidents are the 1st for ages 5-24.

[1] http://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/pdf/10LCID_Unintentional_D...

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#39

Post by zachrose » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:06 PM UTC

minikites wrote: post #3

This get re-published every summer for good reason. Drowning happens frequently and it's theoretically preventable if people knew what to look for. Also, be careful if you have to save a drowning person. The drowning response will cause them to instinctively push you under in an effort to get above water, so make sure you have your own floatation device so they don't end up drowning you.

IIRC, half of the year's drowning deaths in Finland I occur during the solstice, which is happening this very instant.

Re: How to know when someone is in trouble in the water

#40

Post by hluska » Fri, Jun 21, 2013, 5:09 PM UTC

hbharadwaj wrote: post #29

hluska wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious...let's say that you see someone drowning, you aren't a trained lifeguard, and there aren't any lifeguards around. Could an untrained person rescue that person safely? Any tips?

Depends on the situation. In a pool environment, always look for objects to throw. These include tubes, life hooks if available. In case you can't reach the victim, swim towards the victim (but don't reach the victim) with these objects and thrust them out. Else, approach the victim from behind and place your arms under the victims armpits. Place the safety apparatus between you and the victim and drag the victim bac…

Thanks for taking the time to give out this information - I feel much better having read it. I especially appreciate that you mentioned throwing something to the victim and that you gave me some advice in case I can't control a him/her!

Finally, I agree that CPR and lifeguard training was more common, or even mandatory. I felt sick reading that article and realizing that, in certain emergency situations, I'd have absolutely no idea what to do.