Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. When you see visual stimulus, it causes your brain to simulate that in your mind but it's not true that your brain is "practicing" that behavior. When you see or hear someone playing guitar, the same effect is happening in your brain. That doesn't mean that you can watch Stevie Ray V…
> I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. To support your point a little bit, some video game scholars, like Espen Aarseth, don't buy into the idea what the representations provide any relevancy: [1]: "The "royal" theme of the traditional pieces is all but irrelevant to our understanding of chess. Likewise, the dimensions…
It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
31–40 of 45 posts
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#32As far as mainstream gaming goes, the main focus has been in distraction and addiction, using very powerful psychological triggers. (Skinner boxes, variable ratio reinforcement, social pressure, etc.) If fact, these triggers have been deeply embedded in our social media too, turning both video games and social media into tools for manipulating our emotional selves into cycles of distraction and addiction. There's bil…
And to go further, I see games which are already doing this in a positive way. Take a look at Rocksmith, which gamifies the process of learning to play guitar, or Dance Central, which can help teach people how to dance.
World of Warcraft teaches lots of skills (see work by Joi Ito, like [1]), but I am sure you would put that in your "demonize" category.
Just like with other mediums like literature and cinema, you get into a lot of trouble very quickly when you start saying one art piece is worth more than another. Everything has value, even the most mindless game provides mindless escapism, and that is OK. It is OK to escape for a while.
The problem isn't games. The problem is that we have poor motivational draws for other life aspects. Try reading some intrinsic motivational theory like Self-Determination Theory or Reiss 16 Desires.
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. When you see visual stimulus, it causes your brain to simulate that in your mind but it's not true that your brain is "practicing" that behavior. When you see or hear someone playing guitar, the same effect is happening in your brain. That doesn't mean that you can watch Stevie Ray V…
> I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. To support your point a little bit, some video game scholars, like Espen Aarseth, don't buy into the idea what the representations provide any relevancy: [1]: "The "royal" theme of the traditional pieces is all but irrelevant to our understanding of chess. Likewise, the dimensions…
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. To support your point a little bit, some video game scholars, like Espen Aarseth, don't buy into the idea what the representations provide any relevancy: [1]: "The "royal" theme of the traditional pieces is all but irrelevant to our understanding of chess. Likewise, the dimensions…
If that were true, why would gamers prefer games with better graphics? Why does Valve make a fortune selling virtual hats if no one cares how their character looks?
The hats thing is about people meeting certain status motivational needs. Reiss' 16 Desires indicates that people seek status, and hats confer it. There's also a desire for collection, which hats also offer. You'll find many people who go "why do you care about hats? They don't change the game." For them, their desire for how they look or what they have isn't as meaningful. I'm hesitant to say "Reiss' 16 Desires is definitely correct" as all psychology is essentially pretty soft, but it does provide a useful framework for games motivation analysis, which is what I am currently supposed to be writing my PhD thesis on instead of procrastinating on HN :)
Some skins do confer gameplay bonus, even if they don't do it mechanically. League of Legends sells skins, and when you see someone with a champion with a skin on, you know they like that champion. It provides "skintimidation" to the other team.
I don't go as far as Aarseth in terms of rejecting aesthetics or narratives. I like that we have these things, and I like that they are better than they once were. I think most people feel that way. However, it's not a be-all-and-end-all proposition if you play a game that doesn't have a great story or stretches your moral compass. Those games could be wonderful games. There are plenty of great narratives with terrible games attached, like Heavy Rain.
There's room for everything, and I don't think pointing and saying "You're a bad game because of your narrative" is helpful. A better issue is "You're a bad game because of your ludonarrative dissonance" (such as Bioshock Infinite, where the character is trying to escape the ghosts of his past, but ends up murdering hundreds of people anyway) or "You're a bad game because your system simulation is completely screwed up" (imagine a SimCity where you were taught that people loved it if you polluted everything as long as there were low taxes). These are bad designs because they teach the wrong lessons. GTA is a wonderful marriage of design and story: the insanity that the players' are allowed to wreak fits in with the world created. The only way to play GTA subversively is to actually attempt to follow the law except when instructed not to (something Pippin Barr tried in [1]).
[1 pg. 200] http://www.pippinbarr.com/academic/Pippin_Barr_PhD_Thesis.pd...
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Questions to help yourself take games more seriously It's a suggestion. She is sharing an opinion. Nowhere does she cast judgement on how or why you're enjoying your games. She's proposing a way to get a little more intellectual stimulation from games, and you can take it or leave it. While I personally think the specific questions are a bit too broad and shallow, there's no reason for the possibility of an alternati…
_Where is the artistic value in this game?_ Blowing stuff up is fun? Try Robotron, or Serious Sam. You're saying I need to examine someone's motivation and weigh a game's social conscience before I install the thing, or I'm a bad person? Get real. Blowing stuff up is fun. Once upon a time at Atari, one of the head Marketroids in the home computer division decided "No violent games!" The problem was, all of the non-vi…
Well thats the thing... I'm not saying that, and I'm 100% sure the blog author isn't saying that either. Asking yourself what the artistic value in the game is is not the same thing as (yet does often lead to) evaluating the game in a socio-political context. It is examining your responses to the game, be they intellectual or visceral, and asking what elements of the game trigger those responses. Ask yourself how those elements form a coherent experience.
I love shmups and action games. Right now I'm trying to get good at Devil May Cry 4, and the newest game I've played though is Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance. These games have a strong focus on enabling creativity by giving the player avatar as much power and control as possible while balancing the enemy scenarios to still provide a challenge. Since stylish gameplay is the core of these games, asking exactly how the game gives the player so much control and creativity is fundamental to examining their artistic value. But they are also games with narratives: MGR:R is about a psychopathic former child soldier who's turned into a cyborg mercenary. He "refuels" by ripping out his enemies' spines and eating them. DMC4 begins with the series' half-demon protagonist crashing into a church and assassinating the pope. They are games with narratives, and whether or not the narratives are good, they impact the player experience and are certainly worth considering.
All anyone is saying is to try paying more attention to, and reflecting on, what you're thinking and feeling when playing games. You might enjoy them more. You might not.
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
And to go further, I see games which are already doing this in a positive way. Take a look at Rocksmith, which gamifies the process of learning to play guitar, or Dance Central, which can help teach people how to dance.
I think it's a pretty facile view to take that Rocksmith or Dance Central are inherently more meaningful because they teach a certain real world skill. World of Warcraft teaches lots of skills (see work by Joi Ito, like [1]), but I am sure you would put that in your "demonize" category. Just like with other mediums like literature and cinema, you get into a lot of trouble very quickly when you start saying one art pi…
Even the horrible example I was thinking of (Call of Duty) has some benefits.
The problem is, I don't see real life ever being as seductive emotionally as the gaming life. More and more our synthetic realities (video games, social media) are becoming more emotionally charged than our physical layer of reality.
Just look at the number of people walking down the street with their faces in their phones. When they come home it's back to the computers and video games.
Where do we regain the ability to focus in the real world? Or is the constant distraction the new norm for us as a culture?
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#37People play to waste time, to socialize, to take their mind off things, to role play, to test their skills, to play a role outside their normal role, to practice English (or whatever their guild is speaking), to feel needed (in social games), to feel reckless (driving car and spinning out of control with no consequences). I probably left out hundreds of other reasons people play video games.
Telling this diverse group of people 'this is how you should play' isn't productive. You can target one of their goals - lets say the group that wants to socialize, and say 'make sure your guildies are fun loving people, not a boring bunch'. Or if the article is targeting role players - make sure the game is meaningful in some way. But simply saying "What’s the underlying message or moral with this game" to a group of people that may just be using the game to play hit-man, isn't very productive.
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it's a pretty facile view to take that Rocksmith or Dance Central are inherently more meaningful because they teach a certain real world skill. World of Warcraft teaches lots of skills (see work by Joi Ito, like [1]), but I am sure you would put that in your "demonize" category. Just like with other mediums like literature and cinema, you get into a lot of trouble very quickly when you start saying one art pi…
I agree with you here, there are certainly skills to be gained from playing games, and World of Warcraft could certainly be giving a lot as far as social interaction, cooperation, and leadership. Even the horrible example I was thinking of (Call of Duty) has some benefits. The problem is, I don't see real life ever being as seductive emotionally as the gaming life. More and more our synthetic realities (video games,…
The problem isn't the technology, it's us. However, we've survived OK so far. Do I think people spend too much time on their phones Wall-E style? Sure. Do I think it's the phone's fault? No. I think it's an us thing, and we're still working out how to deal with it.
It wasn't long ago that a social convention was popping up where people would put their phones on the table and turn them all onto Airplane Mode. We need new social conventions, but the technology that invades our lives away from the desk is all very new in the grand scheme of things.
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#39"Wonderful ways to think about the games we play" would be a great article. I want to like this article, but it took too many mean turns. It's not considerate of all the reasons we play games.
As John McCarthy (AI, Lisp) used to say: "Hard distinctions make bad philosophy."
Re: It’s time gamers took gaming more seriously
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I think saying that "your brain actively practices killing" is overstating it. It sure sounds good, but it's not even close to reality. To support your point a little bit, some video game scholars, like Espen Aarseth, don't buy into the idea what the representations provide any relevancy: [1]: "The "royal" theme of the traditional pieces is all but irrelevant to our understanding of chess. Likewise, the dimensions…
If that were true, why would gamers prefer games with better graphics? Why does Valve make a fortune selling virtual hats if no one cares how their character looks?
I'm not going to play Bioshock or Dishonored or Call of Duty 42 simply because of "ooh, shiny!", but at the same time we won't complain if it's there. If all else is equal, we often go with the newer one. If I were to buy Bioshock Infinite (or the new Tomb Raider, etc), it would be because I'm interested in the story and the experience, of which the graphics are just part. Perhaps that's because graphics in PC games have been already Pretty Awesome for longer than I've been able to afford the hardware?