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How and why the government is stalking you

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Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#31

Post by hp50g »

anigbrowl wrote: post #24
droopyEyelids wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I blame a lack of historical knowledge combined with the fact that we mostly exist in harmony with our governments. First, few of us have taken the time to read accounts of how the political groups of history have used information against people. So we don't know to do addition when we have one and one. Combine that with the fact that most of us aren't engaged in any sort of activity that incumbent power would like t…

First, few of us have taken the time to read accounts of how the political groups of history have used information against people. I question that assumption. Even people with a superficial knowledge of history are familiar with the existence of the Gestapo and the KGB; even if they're hazy on specific methods, they get the concept of a police state just fine. Just because they may not consider the US to be a police…

They are aware of the concept but are too apathetic to act on it before it happens.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#32

Post by hp50g »

a_p wrote: post #17
cgag wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's always shocking to me how many of the people I graduated with want to go work for 'defence' contractors/intelligence agencies like the NSA. I can't tell if people don't think about the affect they're having on the world or just don't care. I don't have a problem with cow-tipping apps, I just want people to avoid actively harming the world.

Working for an "intelligence" agency, especially in a field like cryptography, allows you access to state-of-the-art technologies and cutting edge research, and an enormous amount of resources that you would not have access to in a civilian job. A famous example of classified cutting edge research is the RSA algorithm which was actually discovered in 1973 by Clifford Cocks. Government agencies sometimes have reputati…

I worked for a similar class of organisation in Europe. It was promoted by my university and we were cherry picked with the threat of no employment otherwise (the whole industry was screwed back then) even though the pay was shit.

Most people realised what nefarious bastards they were within a couple of weeks but once you've got cash coming in, its hard to shake them off and find another job as no one wants a government tainted employee. I had to sleep in my car for 3 months as a result of quitting.

They are also not the best in the field: they are the easiest to manipulate.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#33

Post by youngerdryas »

b1daly wrote: post #29
anigbrowl wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Espionage and counter-espionage has always functioned in an ethical gray area, by necessity. I appreciate that this fails 'the honor code' in many peoples' eyes, but I think it's better than aggressive militarism in that its ultimately far less destructive.

Thank you for saying this. What the us has done with military action is just appalling. To the extent that the US has enemies, spying and information based action is much less destructive. I would also like to ask some of you who seem to take it as av given that any erosion of privacy, any knowledge about you by government is bad: outside of edge cases are we seeing big negative effects from the huge amount of data b…

I am not surprised no one has replied with a scenario which brings calamity. I'm sure many started to but realized how far fetched it would have to be. Few individuals can be a realistic threat to the government. My brother currently thinks he is harming the government by not paying taxes, quite the opposite though.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#34

Post by adestefan »

jackpirate wrote: post #19
a_p wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working for an "intelligence" agency, especially in a field like cryptography, allows you access to state-of-the-art technologies and cutting edge research, and an enormous amount of resources that you would not have access to in a civilian job. A famous example of classified cutting edge research is the RSA algorithm which was actually discovered in 1973 by Clifford Cocks. Government agencies sometimes have reputati…

Most of these people find out that the job is not as "cool" as they thought it would be, and soon find employment elsewhere. I'm one of the few people I know who did this. (I used to be a Navy officer and spent time at the NSA.) By far, the vast majority of friends I had in the Navy wanted to go into defense contracting/spy agencies after they got out. Once your in the military industrial complex, there is a huge cul…

It's not a cult about staying, it's the money. With the right connections you can be a bumbling idiot and still make well over $100k a year.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#35

Post by speeder »

hp50g wrote: post #30
gnosis wrote: post #8

What's even sadder is that many if not most HN users are contributing to the surveillance apparatus by building web apps and infrastructure, promoting it, and not taking a stand against it. How many of you Googlers and Facebookers (and the legions of you working for Facebook/Google wannabes) have really thought hard about what you're doing? How many of you care? How many of you honestly want to do something to stop t…

There are still those of us who don't support total surveillance and will not stand for it. Were probably more traditional Unix people and not so embroiled in technology. Everyone else has been got if you ask me through media, social pressure or plain old apathy. However it's worse than just web sites. I've worked for a nefarious company who feeds of data like theirs. I came to my senses when asked to do things which…

I am very proud to say that my associate was very happy to build a highly ethical company with me.

We make apps for children, and don't put ads, IAP, or content that might cause bad behavior, for example one of the apps I took out a character holding candy before lunch.

Too bad this gave no competitive advantage, but lots of disadvantages, thus I must be happy that the money people in the company let this strong ethical opinion.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#36

Post by MoreMoschops »

hp50g wrote: post #30
gnosis wrote: post #8

What's even sadder is that many if not most HN users are contributing to the surveillance apparatus by building web apps and infrastructure, promoting it, and not taking a stand against it. How many of you Googlers and Facebookers (and the legions of you working for Facebook/Google wannabes) have really thought hard about what you're doing? How many of you care? How many of you honestly want to do something to stop t…

There are still those of us who don't support total surveillance and will not stand for it. Were probably more traditional Unix people and not so embroiled in technology. Everyone else has been got if you ask me through media, social pressure or plain old apathy. However it's worse than just web sites. I've worked for a nefarious company who feeds of data like theirs. I came to my senses when asked to do things which…

"read books instead of use e-readers."

How necessary is that? Does it depend on the eReader? I use a Sony 300 series (which I personally think is about the high point of the eReader evolution, with the exception of the 350 for more screen space in an almost identical sized casing) which is as thankfully dumb and disconnected as eReaders get. It plugs in like an external hard drive and I simply copy epub files onto it.

You couldn't pay me to have a kindle (well, you could, but you'd have to pay me a lot and I'd just sell it and get another Sony).

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#37

Post by hp50g »

MoreMoschops wrote: post #36
hp50g wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are still those of us who don't support total surveillance and will not stand for it. Were probably more traditional Unix people and not so embroiled in technology. Everyone else has been got if you ask me through media, social pressure or plain old apathy. However it's worse than just web sites. I've worked for a nefarious company who feeds of data like theirs. I came to my senses when asked to do things which…

"read books instead of use e-readers." How necessary is that? Does it depend on the eReader? I use a Sony 300 series (which I personally think is about the high point of the eReader evolution, with the exception of the 350 for more screen space in an almost identical sized casing) which is as thankfully dumb and disconnected as eReaders get. It plugs in like an external hard drive and I simply copy epub files onto it…

There are two issues with e-readers which need to be considered. One is obvious, the other is not.

1. e-readers like the Kobo, Kindle, Nook etc (ones tied to a store) phone home and report reading progress and are DRM encumbered. The Kobo even gamifies reading which is just insane if you ask me.

2. The second issue applies to all e-readers and that is that they promote distribution of epub files. The source of epub files is usually illegitimate (as everyone pushes stuff through stores) and the hosts are about as dodgy as can be as well.

Books can also change hands easily.

If you're going to get an e-reader, your approach is the best.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#38

Post by hp50g »

speeder wrote: post #35
hp50g wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are still those of us who don't support total surveillance and will not stand for it. Were probably more traditional Unix people and not so embroiled in technology. Everyone else has been got if you ask me through media, social pressure or plain old apathy. However it's worse than just web sites. I've worked for a nefarious company who feeds of data like theirs. I came to my senses when asked to do things which…

I am very proud to say that my associate was very happy to build a highly ethical company with me. We make apps for children, and don't put ads, IAP, or content that might cause bad behavior, for example one of the apps I took out a character holding candy before lunch. Too bad this gave no competitive advantage, but lots of disadvantages, thus I must be happy that the money people in the company let this strong ethi…

Good for you. I wish you both the best as an ethical company.

Re: How and why the government is stalking you

#40

Post by droopyEyelids »

JVIDEL wrote: post #27
droopyEyelids wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I blame a lack of historical knowledge combined with the fact that we mostly exist in harmony with our governments. First, few of us have taken the time to read accounts of how the political groups of history have used information against people. So we don't know to do addition when we have one and one. Combine that with the fact that most of us aren't engaged in any sort of activity that incumbent power would like t…

That guy Jan supported plain anti-democratic dictatorships and the use of espionage and murder until surprise surprise! he fell out of favor and had to suffer the same ordeals he made others go through, hardly what could happen to the average guy living in a democracy. Put simply, he played with fired and got burned.

I'm not saying to empathize with Jan, instead empathize with all the moderate social democrats the Communists and Nazis fucked over, murdered, and destroyed.
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