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Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

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Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#31

Post by theatrus2 »

prof_hobart wrote: post #23
wmf wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the choice between 24 MP with very high sensitivity or 2 MP with ridiculously high sensitivity, I'm not sure the industry is wrong.

But they aren't the only two options. With the quality of lens on the average compact camera for instance, I struggle to see any real noticable improvement above around 5 MP.

Lenses are very constrained by physics, and cost. Ground glass and more exotic materials are expensive to produce - injection molded plastic isn't. A high MP sensor is miles cheaper than an upgraded optical system.

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#32

Post by theatrus2 »

morsch wrote: post #10
[deleted] wrote: post #3

[deleted]

Moonlight is for the most part just reflected sunlight, so it's not surprising that the colors are very similar. Obviously it's much less bright, by a factor of 500k according to Wikipedia, but that's what this sensor is about. You can get similarly startling images from a plain point and shoot camera by installing it on a tripod and taking long exposure shots of things. You need 30 to 60 seconds exposure, sometimes…

The sensitivity didn't increase by exposing it longer - its simply accumulating more signal over time.

Many sensors are ill-suited to long exposures though. While they can do it, you end up with heat related issues (commonly manifested as stuck pixels and general noise). CCDs also end up saturating and spilling over to adjacent cells, making high dynamic scenes a challenge.

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#33

Post by yread »

arethuza wrote: post #22
eksith wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't he use the same lenses used by NASA on the cameras for the Apollo missions? I think the larger aperture gave better low-light exposure during the candlelit scene (and may have inadvertantly fuelled conspiracy nuts that think the moon landings were a hoax because they think the sunlight reflected off the regolith was a secondary light source).

Looks like that is true: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Zeiss_Planar_50mm_f/0.7

The whole main reference for the article is worth reading

http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/sk/ac/len/page1.htm

and plenty of other fast lenses

http://www.taunusreiter.de/Cameras/Biotar_en.html

and here is a good summary of the developments that went into it (how hard would it be to find this page if not for a link on wiki?!)

http://web.archive.org/web/20090309005033/http://ogiroux.blo...

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#36

Post by zokier »

I wonder what the anticipated applications are? Surveillance seems like one obvious target (and I guess that's what the moonlight-scene was trying to show), at least if the sensor (and thus the final products) is not ridiculously expensive. Also the fact that it is being demoed at "SECURITY SHOW 2013" points towards surveillance.

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#38

Post by baq »

ominous_prime wrote: post #15
Aardwolf wrote: post #12

I would love to see such a sensor for photos instead of video!

of course we would, but photographers wouldn't be too impressed with only capturing 1920(?)x1080 resolution. This gains it's light gathering abilities by simply having much larger "pixels" on the sensor, which can collect more photons. This is the same principal used on the highest end canon eos body, the 1DX, which has slightly lower resolution than the 5DmkIII in order to gain sensitivity.

Native resolution of this baby looks to be 864 mm^2 / 19 micron^2 ~= 45MPix, in line with the latest Nikon and with rumors of high-density FF Canon. The innovation here is noise reduction and not the sensor itself... obviously Canon will charge an arm an a leg for that video camera - and won't ever make it into a DSLR to not cannibalize their profits.

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#39

Post by wiredfool »

davidjohnstone wrote: post #21
eksith wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't he use the same lenses used by NASA on the cameras for the Apollo missions? I think the larger aperture gave better low-light exposure during the candlelit scene (and may have inadvertantly fuelled conspiracy nuts that think the moon landings were a hoax because they think the sunlight reflected off the regolith was a secondary light source).

Yes, an f/0.7 aperture is a ridiculously wide aperture (thus, it lets in a lot of light[1]), two stops brighter than f/1.4 (a "stop" means a doubling of the amount of light; f/1.2 lenses are the fastest lenses commonly available, and they'll cost around $2k), or four stops faster than f/2.8 (which is what the fastest commonly available zoom lenses are, and they're expensive too). Leica make a very rare f/0.95 lens th…

Voigtlander is making an 0.95 25mm m4/3 lens, and it's only $1100 or so.

Re: Canon develops 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor for video capture

#40

Post by thenomad »

baq wrote: post #37

this will be an expensive piece of gear. that moonlit video was just insane.

As a filmmaker, I'm more impressed by the burning incense. I don't even make live-action video (I do animation), and I STILL desperately want a camera that can do that.

I suspect that the results of showing that video to a room full of filmmakers can be summed up in the phrase "Shut up and take my money."

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