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In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

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Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#31
That's really too bad.

I've enjoyed many 40K novels, love the Dawn of War games and even own some table top material, but I wasn't aware of GW's taste for lawsuits until now.

GW just lost a customer.

Thankfully, Dan Abnett isn't afraid to write original novels and Relic has other franchises.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#32
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why is this not an open and shut case ?

Because lack of "prior art" is not a requirement for trademark, nor is uniqueness. "Coke" has other meanings http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coke_(fuel) and yet is still trademarked.

That said, isn't it the case that one can't just take something that exists in common usage and trademark it as-is?

For example, the basic structure of the fairy tale about Aladdin and the magic lamp had been around for a long time, and was clearly not originated by Disney. Consequently, Disney has no right to claim trademark or copyright control over the name Aladdin or or anything generally related to the story. They only get rights over their own work - additions they made to the story, characters' appearances, etc.

Similarly, Games Workshop shouldn't be able to own the phrase 'space marines'. At most, all they should get to control is the use of the name Space Marines to describe the surgically-enhanced cybernetic super-soldiers that are peculiar to their franchise.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#33
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They only "own" it because they're taking it. Space marines were used in science fiction before they did it. They're taking something that doesn't belong to them, by being much bigger than their opponent. The word for that is bullying.

Here's the Games Workshop customer support email: CustServ@gwplc.com Can't hurt to let them know we aren't pleased.

Can't hurt, but I suspect it won't help. I wrote in, and it took less than two minutes to receive a response which basically said "write to legal, not to us."

Here's to hoping I'm wrong and they listen to unhappy people.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#34
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why is this not an open and shut case ?

It may be, but an open and shut case still costs 10's of thousands of dollars, and that's if it doesn't go to court.

This is where common law systems really bother me.

When the legal system is set up in such a manner that defending oneself in civil court is more-or-less impossible for people who aren't wealthy enough to pay hundreds of dollars per hour for legal representation, the phrase "equal protection under the law" begins to sound like nothing more than a cruel joke.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#36
The really unfortunate part of the situation is that they are generally required to defend their trademark or else it goes away. Even when they know something is "fair use" or whatever.

"Unlike patents and copyrights, which in theory are granted for one-off fixed terms, trademarks remain valid as long as the owner actively uses and defends them and maintains their registrations with the competent authorities. This often involves payment of a periodic renewal fee." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark#Comparison_with_paten...

Of course I still think that there is no effing way that they should have gotten a trademark on "Space Marine." Totally bogus. I want to start selling a product called "Legal" and trademark it and use that trademark to shut down every company that offers legal services.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#37
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GW has previous form, they issued a bunch of C&Ds recently to many websites. And they're a pretty big company. They're a PLC trading on London Stock Exchange. ( http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices-and-marke... )

If they're public, they're subject to shareholder reaction. Perhaps making large shareholders aware of the PR damage the company is about to take is a viable path.

They were using this sort of legal bullying as a tactic when I was a kid. They've seen more than their share of "PR damage" in the past and it doesn't put them off.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#38
There's some interesting discussion on Scalzi's blog, too. Here's a bit of information I found rather interesting and potentially useful (from the comments section):

The mark was registered for US Class 22 – games and such – and is most specifically not the class(es) for printed books or ebooks.

Here's the link to the comment in question:

http://whatever.scalzi.com/2013/02/06/space-marines-and-the-...

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because lack of "prior art" is not a requirement for trademark, nor is uniqueness. "Coke" has other meanings http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coke_(fuel) and yet is still trademarked.

That said, isn't it the case that one can't just take something that exists in common usage and trademark it as-is? For example, the basic structure of the fairy tale about Aladdin and the magic lamp had been around for a long time, and was clearly not originated by Disney. Consequently, Disney has no right to claim trademark or copyright control over the name Aladdin or or anything generally related to the story. Th…

Was "space marine" in common usage in 1987, though? The fact that it exists in a long out-of-print pulp novel doesn't mean that everyone understood its meaning. Again, this isn't a patent. All that's required is that, when the trademark was registered, GW's usage of the term was unique and relevant to their business.

Re: In the future, all space marines will be Warhammer 40K space marines

#40

I knew this was going to happen some day. Games Workshop is essentially two separate companies, the raving legal department/copyright trolls (A couple of years ago they regularly put full page colour adverts in all the British wargaming magazines warning that they would enforce their IP with the full power afforded to them by the law, it was generally considered a bad joke by most.) and the (for a lack of a better te…

Are there alternate rulesets that happen to be playable with the same minis? Could there legally be such things?

There are generic wargame rulesets out there that you can play with basically any minis. For instance:

http://15mm.co.uk/USE_ME_15mm_Sci-fi_wargame_rules.htm

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