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Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

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Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#31

Post by dimitar »

dimitar wrote: post #30

I prefer the maps in Wikimedia Commons - there are some amateur maps, which may be even better than some lifted from expired-copyright atlases. There are quite a few different historical maps of the same year/region - it is very important to have them side by side, because history is very subjective and historical maps are only a subjective and deficient in data representations of historical presence. Maps (by centur…

For example:

- Bavaria is shown to be a Austrian possession in 1800, which is incorrect. Consider the implications if Bavaria was a part of Austria for a while - would there be a Southern German nation? Or would be in fact inconsiderable that Austria is a separate state given the overlap with other German states? If you have only this map as a teaching tool you are implicitly giving a false impression of history.

- There are no Ukrainian states or predecessors (the Cossack Sich) after the 14th century on any of these maps. By omitting this state the appearance of Ukraine seems mysterious in 20th century and a key narrative in the histories of Poland, Russia and even Sweden (the winter war) simply disappears.

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#32

Post by Jd »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #28
nagrom wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure whether you are pro- or anti-EU with that comment... You are aware that the union in year 1 was effectively a somewhat brutal dictatorship imposed by force where human life was treated as a toy for an elite caste that ruled from afar, right? There was no 'EU community' then. There was the brutal rule of hierarchical violence and fealty to pay to a foreign emperor. Regardless of what you think of the EU, the…

Should be a link to "Life of Brian" here - where Cleese says "What have the Romans every given us? Nothun'!" and a cell member raises his hand. "The Aquaduct?" "Oh yeah, the Aquaduct, yeah, that." And on and on until they have a long list of improvements instituted by the Romans.

That was easy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExWfh6sGyso

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#33

Post by riffraff »

nagrom wrote: post #12
jfaucett wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm definately pro EU and also quite aware of the Roman Empire's injustices, I just think its interesting that a map of the current EU member states - http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:EU_Member_states_and_Cand... , has a large overlap, minus Turkey and the arabic countries. Which makes me wonder/hope that perhaps they could also one day become member states in a harmonious union. Obviously, this observation only co…

I don't think it is so much of a surprise. The Roman empire enforced a lot of cultural norms and spread a common religion. The religion, in particular, was responsible for a largely common education and that still exists today! It is therefore no surprise that the member states that share that common education have a lot of political interaction. However, often that political interaction has been warlike and negative…

I believe you are thinking of the existing Bologna Process[0] which is, at heart, an attempt to build an EU-wide common higher education system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_Process

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#34

Post by youngerdryas »

d_theorist wrote: post #27
rtpg wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So manifest destiny was also a no-go? Federal systems are meant to be scalable. The US gov't might have its problems, but the land size it governs is not the source of these. If you needed proof of concept, there you go.

The US federal government is a perfect example. Remote - geographically, culturally, and financially - from the people it governs, it has continually eroded the freedoms and protections of the bill of rights, and has usurped the sovereign authority of the state governments. The federal government has been a great success for those with the money to control it and bend its power to their will, but has been an absolute…

Free Quebec!

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#35

Post by nagrom »

riffraff wrote: post #33
nagrom wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it is so much of a surprise. The Roman empire enforced a lot of cultural norms and spread a common religion. The religion, in particular, was responsible for a largely common education and that still exists today! It is therefore no surprise that the member states that share that common education have a lot of political interaction. However, often that political interaction has been warlike and negative…

I believe you are thinking of the existing Bologna Process[0] which is, at heart, an attempt to build an EU-wide common higher education system. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_Process

Yes and no. The Bologna Process, as I understand it, is a harmonisation of academic qualifications designed to allow someone with a degree in Italy to be qualified to do a PhD. in the Netherlands, etc. I'm talking more about a FOSS-style curriculum that doesn't necessarily address economic arguments, but acts as a basis for what modern European school children should know and learn. Some common cultural grounding that clearly states an accumulated sum of knowledge and learning techniques that defines what it means to be 'educated'.

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#36

Post by maxprogram »

tzury wrote: post #21

Atlas of The World History (animated) http://www.atlasofworldhistory.com/ also http://www.timemaps.com/history

The project I'm currently working on is called Atlastory, and would be a Google Maps-like interface throughout history. The idea is to eventually have political maps like those in the OP + specific maps for historic events.

Demo is up at http://atlastory.com (for now only maps are WWII and Civil War). If anyone's interested in helping out please contact me. (Currently looking for another developer to help with the much more complicated back-end)

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#37

Post by g2e »

maxprogram wrote: post #36
tzury wrote: post #21

Atlas of The World History (animated) http://www.atlasofworldhistory.com/ also http://www.timemaps.com/history

The project I'm currently working on is called Atlastory, and would be a Google Maps-like interface throughout history. The idea is to eventually have political maps like those in the OP + specific maps for historic events. Demo is up at http://atlastory.com (for now only maps are WWII and Civil War). If anyone's interested in helping out please contact me. (Currently looking for another developer to help with the mu…

Currently working on a similar project as well!

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#38

Post by sbmassey »

igravious wrote: post #20
d_theorist wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment exposes the elitist Europhile mindset beautifully. Yes, another Roman Empire to allow a small imperial caste to rule the entire continent is exactly what they are aiming for.

Where on earth did you get that reading from? Just because someone wishes for the artificial divisions that divide us to melt away does not they want a return to imperial hegemony. Your comment reflects more on your euro-skepticism than the claims you are making of the grandparent.

The EU is all about setting up a centralised governing power over Europe. Given that Europe contains many different cultures, this will inevitably be an Imperial government, since there is no single demos with broad agreement on policy to be represented by the European state. The EU is really the last thing Europe needs: all the European creativity and energy over the last few centuries has come from competition between small nation states, while huge states everywhere eventually run out of cash and become oppressive and bureaucratic (keep an eye on the US, folks).

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#39

Post by jacoblyles »

Svip wrote: post #17
jamesmcbennett wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys might like a TEDx talk by a friend of mine Grzegorz 'The collapse of complex societies' specifically Roman Empire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcE0rIEHEFI

I am already reading Edward Gibbon's The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire , and while research since its conception may have disputed certain facts unknown at Gibbon's time (it was published in 1776), it is still an excellent detailed account of the Roman Empire from 170s and onward, without ever getting boring, because of Gibbon's excellent prose.

Check out "The History of Rome" podcast by Mike Duncan, for a highly enjoyable and thoroughly researched account of Rome from ~400BC to the last Western emperor.

Re: Periodis Web – A Historical Atlas and Gazetteer of Europe from Year 1 to 2000

#40

Post by huxley »

Svip wrote: post #17
jamesmcbennett wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys might like a TEDx talk by a friend of mine Grzegorz 'The collapse of complex societies' specifically Roman Empire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcE0rIEHEFI

I am already reading Edward Gibbon's The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire , and while research since its conception may have disputed certain facts unknown at Gibbon's time (it was published in 1776), it is still an excellent detailed account of the Roman Empire from 170s and onward, without ever getting boring, because of Gibbon's excellent prose.

A good popular history of the other side of the "Fall of the Roman Empire" is "Terry Jones' Barbarians".

I scare-quote "Fall of the Roman Empire" because even though Rome itself was sacked, the Eastern half of the Roman Empire kept going for another millennium, though known to us moderns as the Byzantine Empire (it was known to all contemporaries merely as The Roman Empire).

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