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Everything you do is being recorded

theatlantic.com

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Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#31

Post by tdeck »

zhoBEENG wrote: post #25
tdeck wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard for me to take this perspective seriously when you describe a cellphone as "entirely optional". Our society is structured around the assumption that you'll have not just a cellphone, but a smartphone. Without acknowledging that, how can we have a realistic discussion? Many businesses require you to use a smartphone in some way. Some government services also require one. Before cellphones, there were payphon…

I do not carry a cellphone. I am employed and live in a major city. I never think about not having one. I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones. It is entirely optional.

> I am employed and live in a major city. ... . I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones.

This doesn't mean much. I know multiple people who fit this description, live in the US, and can't speak or read English. However, speaking English isn't meaningfully optional. You will face constant limitations and problems in every aspect of life. There are people who don't use electricity, so I guess by your definition that's optional too?

> I never think about not having one.

Sure you don't.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#32

Post by exe34 »

Permit wrote: post #21
Razengan wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why should I find you repulsive? Me googling your shit might lead to your real name, your family photos etc Just because it's all public doesn't mean you want the cashier from the supermarket following you around to your family picnic or just because you like to let the sunlight in doesn't mean you want random pedestrians peering in through your windows.. I can't believe this needs to be spelled out here: "Public"…

> Just because it's all public doesn't mean you want the cashier from the supermarket following you around to your family picnic. This has never happened to me. Out of the space of “bad things that can happen to me” I don’t have time to worry about things with such a small probability of occurring.

I think if you're a fat middle aged man, it's not likely to happen to you personally. But you must have daughters, nieces, a mother, or some sort of female presence in your life. It happens to people like them.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#33

Post by Bender »

tdeck wrote: post #23
zhoBEENG wrote: post #2

Obama was promoting The Age of Surveillance Capitalism over seven years ago now. Industry insiders have known all this since 1999. Yet almost every single person I know carries a cellphone and drives a car with telemetry, things that are entirely optional. Most humans use Meta products regularly; also optional. For all the feigned outrage, people want this, and will work hard every day to pay for the next iteration o…

It's hard for me to take this perspective seriously when you describe a cellphone as "entirely optional". Our society is structured around the assumption that you'll have not just a cellphone, but a smartphone. Without acknowledging that, how can we have a realistic discussion? Many businesses require you to use a smartphone in some way. Some government services also require one. Before cellphones, there were payphon…

The only reason I take my cell phone with me is in the event my truck breaks down. I have lost count of how many times I forgot it at home. I've had business tell me to install some app but I just tell them no or make them do the work for me. If they want money they will fill in the information. Over the years I have been parting ways from businesses that I can not walk in and talk face-to-face with someone and for good reason as it is getting harder and harder to reach a real person in customer support for online businesses. People are getting accounts disabled or deleted with no recourse.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#34

Post by zhoBEENG »

tdeck wrote: post #31
zhoBEENG wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not carry a cellphone. I am employed and live in a major city. I never think about not having one. I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones. It is entirely optional.

> I am employed and live in a major city. ... . I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones. This doesn't mean much. I know multiple people who fit this description, live in the US, and can't speak or read English. However, speaking English isn't meaningfully optional. You will face constant limitations and problems in every aspect of life. There are peo…

Genuinely. Thinking back on it now, the only times I notice it is in some restaurants that don’t have paper menus out by default. I need to ask for one, which feels very odd and kind of awkward. This is the only instance I can think of.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#35

Post by zhoBEENG »

sd9 wrote: post #27
zhoBEENG wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not carry a cellphone. I am employed and live in a major city. I never think about not having one. I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones. It is entirely optional.

Counterpoint: I could not do my job without one. Clients expect support over WhatsApp.

For sure, but you still do retain the option to leave it at work, unless you have some kind of 24/7 sales job. I do think privacy at work is not an option for most people.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#36

Post by cyanydeez »

zhoBEENG wrote: post #2

Obama was promoting The Age of Surveillance Capitalism over seven years ago now. Industry insiders have known all this since 1999. Yet almost every single person I know carries a cellphone and drives a car with telemetry, things that are entirely optional. Most humans use Meta products regularly; also optional. For all the feigned outrage, people want this, and will work hard every day to pay for the next iteration o…

so obama was doing what in 2019? are you an LLM trained in 2023?

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#37

Post by dingocat »

zhoBEENG wrote: post #2

Obama was promoting The Age of Surveillance Capitalism over seven years ago now. Industry insiders have known all this since 1999. Yet almost every single person I know carries a cellphone and drives a car with telemetry, things that are entirely optional. Most humans use Meta products regularly; also optional. For all the feigned outrage, people want this, and will work hard every day to pay for the next iteration o…

> Most humans use Meta products regularly; also optional. For all the feigned outrage, people want this, and will work hard every day to pay for the next iteration of the surveillance apparatus.

This is a perfect example of the revealed-preference fallacy. The use of providers like Meta does not reflect a well-informed, freely chosen preference. Meta spends a ton of money to squash competition, remove viable alternatives, and to make their products addictive.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#38

Post by tdeck »

zhoBEENG wrote: post #34
tdeck wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am employed and live in a major city. ... . I know multiple other people, also employed, living both rurally and in cities, who do not carry cellphones. This doesn't mean much. I know multiple people who fit this description, live in the US, and can't speak or read English. However, speaking English isn't meaningfully optional. You will face constant limitations and problems in every aspect of life. There are peo…

Genuinely. Thinking back on it now, the only times I notice it is in some restaurants that don’t have paper menus out by default. I need to ask for one, which feels very odd and kind of awkward. This is the only instance I can think of.

What happens when you're meeting up with someone? With the folks I know who don't have a phone, this is always a real pain point because they don't have a way to communicate or receive changes of plans, "I'm going to be late", etc...

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#39

Post by vouwfietsman »

ryu2k2 wrote: post #26
zhoBEENG wrote: post #2

Obama was promoting The Age of Surveillance Capitalism over seven years ago now. Industry insiders have known all this since 1999. Yet almost every single person I know carries a cellphone and drives a car with telemetry, things that are entirely optional. Most humans use Meta products regularly; also optional. For all the feigned outrage, people want this, and will work hard every day to pay for the next iteration o…

People wouldn't want this if they were adequately educated.

No, this is not the way to go. Consumers cannot possibly understand all potential ways in which they can be screwed over, and even if they could, it is entirely likely that there are no good choices because consumers will have to choose between e.g privacy violation or environmental destruction, or privacy violation of some degree vs another degree.

This is why governments exist.

Re: Everything you do is being recorded

#40

Post by Laurel1234 »

bossyTeacher wrote: post #9
Razengan wrote: post #3

The EFF or some other watchdog should put out some public ads that depict corporations as a creepy person stalking someone: It's a lot more disgusting and universally hated when you hear about a peeping tom, or a pervert, or a jealous ex hounding someone, but when faceless corporations and governments do it to EVERYBODY 24/7, everyone's like, ehh. I mean, right now, just think about me, clicking on your HN profile, g…

I think people's idea of privacy is very simplistic and personal and relies on the disgust of a human peering over your files. Most laypeople don't have the same disgust of machines peering over their personal files that is why the weirdo video recording elicits a negative response but Meta or Alphabet doing it doesn't. Plus the fact that they "depend" on Meta and Alphabet tech makes it easier to give them a pass not…

I think people would find it disgusting, it's just very hard to know what data is being used and how and sold to whom by these companies. It's a very opaque by design.
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