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AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

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Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#31

Post by Paracompact »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #29
Paracompact wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why you would be downvoted. Is your comment raising a pitchfork? Yes. But sometimes when a person's life gets ruined, pitchforks deserve to come out. > Richardson’s attorney showed time sheets proving he was at work 400 miles away from Florida when the stolen car was sold. Richardson said he has never been to Florida, and his attorney tried to present this evidence for months. > Richardson alleged…

People have made accounts just to downvote me. So I must be doing something right.

> People have made accounts just to downvote me.

How can you tell?

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#32

Post by AndrewKemendo »

Paracompact wrote: post #31
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have made accounts just to downvote me. So I must be doing something right.

> People have made accounts just to downvote me. How can you tell?

A greentext username with 10 minute old account, zero karma and 1 comment that comment being something negative in response usually

There was an example months ago but I don’t keep track of the specifics

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#33

Post by blastonico »

dqv wrote: post #22

> He stated he was held in the Mecklenburg County Jail for one month. > While he was incarcerated, Richardson lost his job and his home. He also said he lost custody of two of his children. Alright. Time to ban AI in policing. It can't be used responsibly, so it can't be used at all.

Do you prefer human identification, like picking the suspect among a group lineup? More accurate I guess?

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#34

Post by blastonico »

none2585 wrote: post #24
giantg2 wrote: post #14

This isn't just AI misidentification. This is also an eye witness picking him out of a lineup. This is really AI extending the reach of the already sketchy eye witness practice.

Racist technology and a racist plaintiff in two racist states. What could go wrong????

Three "racist" in a sentence is a bingo. Congratulations.

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#35

Post by hackingonempty »

blastonico wrote: post #33
dqv wrote: post #22

> He stated he was held in the Mecklenburg County Jail for one month. > While he was incarcerated, Richardson lost his job and his home. He also said he lost custody of two of his children. Alright. Time to ban AI in policing. It can't be used responsibly, so it can't be used at all.

Do you prefer human identification, like picking the suspect among a group lineup? More accurate I guess?

The article says the cops used "AI" to find a suspect then the victim identified them in a photo lineup. That provided the probable cause to get a judge to sign a warrant.

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#36

Post by hackingonempty »

daohieu91 wrote: post #13

85% accurate is doing a lot of hiding LOL. Searching a multi-million-face gallery and even high per-comparison accuray turns into mostly false positive. THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause.

> THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause.

That's why the cops followed up with a photo lineup shown to the victim before applying for a warrant.

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#37

Post by hattmall »

hackingonempty wrote: post #36
daohieu91 wrote: post #13

85% accurate is doing a lot of hiding LOL. Searching a multi-million-face gallery and even high per-comparison accuray turns into mostly false positive. THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause.

> THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause. That's why the cops followed up with a photo lineup shown to the victim before applying for a warrant.

Which is stupid though because obviously it's just going to be someone that looks like the person they are after. The idea with a lineup is that you have some other sort of evidence, not based on how people look, and then have them identify the person. If you used a tool to find people that look a certain way and then put that person in a line up with other "non-85%" matches it's reasonable the respondent would pick that person.

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#38

Post by dqv »

Paracompact wrote: post #26
SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #18

> Richardson’s attorney showed time sheets proving he was at work 400 miles away from Florida when the stolen car was sold. Richardson said he has never been to Florida, and his attorney tried to present this evidence for months. I continue to not understand why anyone finds it tolerable for the justice system to move so slowly. I don't want to make excuses for AI identification, but no identification process is perf…

> I don't want to make excuses for AI identification, but no identification process is perfect, it should not be possible that it takes months to clear up. Indeed you shouldn't make excuses. "{Sketchy component} is just one part of the process and is harmless in principle because we have other safeguards such as... nothing we care to subject to your scrutiny" is the prototypical excuse of a broken system: > The offic…

It's obvious what any sane society should do in this case, what actual safeguards would be. A sane society would have a social safety net so that being jailed for 3 months and subsequently released innocent wouldn't ruin your life. Not only did he get punished by having to spend 3 months in jail, he also now has to go and find housing, a job, and go through the civil court system, which is even slower, to ... still be made less than whole. I won't be surprised that the police argue and win with a qualified immunity defense.

To make matters worse, mugshots get people prejudiced from jobs regardless of an HNers ability to discern between a charge and a conviction.

True criminal justice, true innocence until proven guilty would have had his obligations to pay rent/mortgage/bills paused, his employer barred from firing him for missed work, and so on.

(I had to keep editing my post - I just want to say I think it's ridiculous that this dude had to be in jail FOR 3 MONTHS)

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#39

Post by m463 »

hackingonempty wrote: post #36
daohieu91 wrote: post #13

85% accurate is doing a lot of hiding LOL. Searching a multi-million-face gallery and even high per-comparison accuray turns into mostly false positive. THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause.

> THese systems are only ever defensible as an investigative lead, neve as probable cause. That's why the cops followed up with a photo lineup shown to the victim before applying for a warrant.

"followed up"...

he was extradited from 400 miles away in a different state, had never been to florida, and had timesheets from working at his job at the time.

how did that craziness even pull him into the lineup?

Honestly, at some point this kind of tool is going to find LOTS of similar people from a pool of 350,000,000

We need a new term for this, maybe likeness-fishing.

Re: AI misidentification results in wrongful arrest; man seeks justice

#40

Post by pants2 »

At first I thought this was a re-post of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48449513, but no, it seems this is becoming a trend.

Especially the "jailed for one month with no evidence" thing. Well, except for a lineup, which I've learned is about as legit as a lie-detector test, field sobriety test, or a drug-sniffing dog; tenuous at best and very easy to get a false positive.

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