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A portentous reunion

bcantrill.dtrace.org

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Re: A portentous reunion

#31

Post by RugnirViking »

jcgrillo wrote: post #26
bcantrill wrote: post #2

I know I have already written a (long!) piece on this, so I don't want to expand too much here -- but this really was a very odd experience, to be talking with (understandably!) anxious parents of young adults about the peril of dehumanization while at the same time having this intensely human experience very much enabled by an LLM. More than anything, it reinforced something that I think many of us believe: the futu…

I'm curious whether you have any insights into why high quality LLM-assisted (or enabled?) projects seem so relatively rare? Instead it seems like the preponderant contribution is a deluge of low quality slop. You didn't share yours and Adam's prompts in the post, so I'm left wondering how much of the success of this project is attributable to your collective ability and experience (both with this particular project…

for the same reason that there is so much bad writing online? you'd think that making it much easier to make large projects would mean a great many more people would make large projects - this will inevitably reduce quality.

The number of people with the time and dilligence, the people who previously would have been making them previously, is much fewer. They hide themselves away to find likeminded people anyway, but now its even harder to find them amongst all the deafening slop.

Re: A portentous reunion

#32

Post by RugnirViking »

eichin wrote: post #27
sanderjd wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why use Claude then? I don't understand this question in response to the quote preceding it. He just explained why Claude was useful in this instance.

I read the point as: if it's an existential threat that you've got principled objections to - why would it even matter that it's useful ?

the entire piece is about nostalgia + this tension?

Re: A portentous reunion

#33

Post by simeonmiteff »

fasterik wrote: post #16
wat10000 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of my favorite quotes, from Stephenson's The Diamond Age : "The difference between ignorant and educated people is that the latter know more facts. But that has nothing to do with whether they are stupid or intelligent. The difference between stupid and intelligent people—and this is true whether or not they are well-educated—is that intelligent people can handle subtlety. They are not baffled by ambiguous or eve…

Great quote. Thanks for reminding me I need to check out Neal Stephenson!

Ah you're in for a treat.

Let me know when you recognise Claude hiding Diamond Age (time travelling to the early/mid 90s)

;-)

Re: A portentous reunion

#34

Post by [deleted] »

lorecore wrote: post #9

I feel like the last 30 years are significantly less distinctive than the prior 30 (actually 70+) years. The 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s all had iconic and partitioned cultures that are instantly recognizable. I feel like that started to fade a bit in the 90s (what I call the Pottery Barn decade). The 2000s have felt more "alive" to me than the 90s but they're also significantly more post-modern and less dis…

[deleted]

Re: A portentous reunion

#35

Post by networked »

lorecore wrote: post #9

I feel like the last 30 years are significantly less distinctive than the prior 30 (actually 70+) years. The 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s all had iconic and partitioned cultures that are instantly recognizable. I feel like that started to fade a bit in the 90s (what I call the Pottery Barn decade). The 2000s have felt more "alive" to me than the 90s but they're also significantly more post-modern and less dis…

How distinct was 1940s US culture from the 1930s? To me, a European born much later, the 1940s are the decade of 20th-century American aesthetics that blends the most into the previous. The changes I see are all related to WWII. Civilian everyday life captured in film and press photos seems the same as in the 1930s.

Re: A portentous reunion

#36

Post by sedimannapoleon »

RugnirViking wrote: post #30
throw0101a wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> […] but this really was a very odd experience, to be talking with (understandably!) anxious parents of young adults about the peril of dehumanization while at the same time having this intensely human experience very much enabled by an LLM. While it just came out, are you planning on reading Pope Leo's encyclical Magnifica Humanitas ? * https://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/encyclicals/docume... * https://en.wi…

it is really very long. I was trying to read it on monday evening and an eyebrow was raised when, after some time, I saw CHAPTER ONE and realised that up until that point I had been reading the foreword!

[dead]

Re: A portentous reunion

#37

Post by rincebrain »

jcgrillo wrote: post #26
bcantrill wrote: post #2

I know I have already written a (long!) piece on this, so I don't want to expand too much here -- but this really was a very odd experience, to be talking with (understandably!) anxious parents of young adults about the peril of dehumanization while at the same time having this intensely human experience very much enabled by an LLM. More than anything, it reinforced something that I think many of us believe: the futu…

I'm curious whether you have any insights into why high quality LLM-assisted (or enabled?) projects seem so relatively rare? Instead it seems like the preponderant contribution is a deluge of low quality slop. You didn't share yours and Adam's prompts in the post, so I'm left wondering how much of the success of this project is attributable to your collective ability and experience (both with this particular project…

There exist a great many people in the world who think that the only important thing is having a good enough idea, and everything else is almost valueless by comparison. You've probably met them, people who say things like "I just need someone to code it, can you sign this NDA, what do you mean you want to be paid, it's just coding?"

They exist in other formats too - blogs in the vein of "for exposure" cover the same premise, mostly.

Vibe coding has allowed them all to try and show everyone how right they were.

Re: A portentous reunion

#38

Post by neogodless »

colechristensen wrote: post #23
fasterik wrote: post #13

Re: the anxiety of parents about the future: the people who best handle rapidly changing circumstances are the ones who are comfortable with ambiguity and uncertainty. I think it's far less important to teach young people specific skills in technology X, and far more important to teach them how to regulate their emotions, how to make plans and effectively execute on them, and how to be objective about their own stren…

Emotional intelligence about yourself and others is important, sure. But you're confusing acquisition of facts and education. Many people are effectively illiterate for all but the most simple communication. Likewise so many people are innumerate and without basic reason or understanding of basic rhetoric both making and evaluating arguments and information. Teaching math, history, and language isn't about rememberin…

> comfortable with ambiguity and uncertainty

> regulate their emotions

> Emotional intelligence

I'm not sure we read the same parent comment. There is almost nothing in there about emotional intelligence beyond learning self-regulation, but emotional intelligence is at least as much about understanding others' emotions, understanding social cues and etiquette. But the bulk of the parent comment is about adaptability, general self-awareness and self-examination.

You then make an argument that education does, in fact, teach those critical skills indirectly through basic subjects. Having given such a bold premise, you would need to back it up with at least some supporting evidence. Given that you provided none at all, you shouldn't be surprised that no one sees reason to agree with that premise.

Re: A portentous reunion

#39

Post by lorecore »

networked wrote: post #35
lorecore wrote: post #9

I feel like the last 30 years are significantly less distinctive than the prior 30 (actually 70+) years. The 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s all had iconic and partitioned cultures that are instantly recognizable. I feel like that started to fade a bit in the 90s (what I call the Pottery Barn decade). The 2000s have felt more "alive" to me than the 90s but they're also significantly more post-modern and less dis…

How distinct was 1940s US culture from the 1930s? To me, a European born much later, the 1940s are the decade of 20th-century American aesthetics that blends the most into the previous. The changes I see are all related to WWII. Civilian everyday life captured in film and press photos seems the same as in the 1930s.

I think the 1940s war time culture is pretty distinct. Aside from that, I agree, those are probably aesthetically the most similar of the bunch.
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