Airport Security Is Killing Us • Hacker News Board

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#31

Post by throwaway1979 » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:10 PM UTC

clauretano wrote: post #22

reneherse wrote: post #15

While waiting this morning to get through security, I overheard a TSA agent saying they were undergoing a downsizing at that airport (BDL, which is a pretty small international airport in Connecticut) from 200 to 50 on staff. So there's one "anecdata" point that the footprint of the TSA may already be shrinking. He also mentioned it was downsizing through attrition rather than layoffs, which is probably an easier str…

BDL just keeps getting worse. It's already hundreds of dollars less expensive (during the holidays) and takes less time to fly into say Newark and take an Amtrak to Connecticut.

Do you mean "more" expensive?

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#32

Post by mkhattab » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:12 PM UTC

I've always felt that airport security was always about testing the limits of the complacency of the people and not really about security. I imagine some person complaining during a security checkpoint, holding up the line, and some lady yelling from behind in support of the government keeping "us" safe. It's kind of pathetic and undignified.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#33

Post by grecy » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:13 PM UTC

cryptoz wrote: post #16

indiecore wrote: post #5

If you can avoid it* never travel through the united states. *Edit

That's excellent advice to those who live elsewhere, but there are hundreds of millions of people who cannot possibly follow your advice.

Luckily it's only ~4.5% of the world's population.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#34

Post by mstefanko » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:14 PM UTC

seiji wrote: post #4

What is the answer though? Can you imagine a politician running under a "massively downsize the TSA" banner? Would any existing Washington elected official take up the cause? They can't even repeal the comically silly shoe removal procedure (unless you're under 12 or over 75, because no terr'ist would ever foot kerplode those demographic stereotypes).

This is my questions as well, I think the TSA at this point is far more trouble than the massive budget the government is wasting on them. I've read countless articles and watched countless videos complaining about the TSA, pointing out their flaws. But I've yet to see a reasonable plan to cut their budget. And even if someone was able to lower their budget, what happens if something does happen then. I'd love to see any plans, but just cutting the TSA budget entirely has obvious ill effects, it's definitely not as easy as saying, "The TSA is useless, get rid of them."

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#35

Post by cousin_it » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:15 PM UTC

> In fact, extremist Islamic terrorism resulted in just 200 to 400 deaths worldwide outside the war zones of Afghanistan and Iraq — the same number, Mueller noted in a 2011 report (http://politicalscience.osu.edu/faculty/jmueller/CNApart.pdf), as die in bathtubs in the U.S. alone each year.

Can anyone find a citation for the "200 to 400 deaths" claim? The NCTC report (http://www.nctc.gov/docs/2011_NCTC_Annual_Report_Final.pdf) seems to give much higher numbers, unless I'm missing something.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#36

Post by citizens » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:15 PM UTC

pavel_lishin wrote: post #7

joonix wrote: post #2

I opt-out of the x-ray scanner every single time, and so should you. It really doesn't take much longer to go through the process. Show up 3 minutes earlier if you have to. You're rushing to the gate, for what? To sit there longer? Boarding with the crowds is stressful anyways. The most relaxed way to board is at the very end -- there's no more line, I just walk right into the plane, most people are seated, and just…

> I understand the situation is different if you really want your carry-on bag to stow above you. Or in the cabin. If you're the last to board, there's a very real possibility that they may have to gate-check your bag, which adds additional wait time at the end of your journey at best, and your bag arriving in Minnesota while you're touching down in Dallas at worst.

Which, of course, has become much more of a problem since the airlines started charging for checked bags/IRS made baggage fees tax-exempt.

"...amounts paid for baggage services (such as Service G) are not subject to the tax" [http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-wd/1002004.pdf]

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#37

Post by Stratoscope » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:16 PM UTC

jeshan wrote: post #6

This is so NOT relevant at HackerNews. Why do you guys think other 'hackers' would be interested in such news? Can't they find newspapers on their own?

It's a story of unintended consequences, of an attempted bug fix that introduces a new bug. A story about choosing a technology that seems to serve your needs but doesn't serve your customers. A story of what can go wrong when you've locked yourself into your business model and company culture and can't pivot.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#38

Post by jpxxx » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:17 PM UTC

A quibble, because this whole fucking disgusting thing fills me with limitless rage:

TSA agents do not perform 'pat-downs'. Pat-downs are very quick checks to see if any obvious weapons are being concealed on someone's body. Police will do these before putting a suspect into a police vehicle, for instance.

TSA employees do what are called 'custody searches', designed to find contraband material on detainees. These are only performed under specific scenarios, such as being incarcerated.

Custody searches in this context are forbidden by the fourth amendment, by the way, regardless of what the TSA's legal team may claim.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#39

Post by adrr » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:17 PM UTC

joonix wrote: post #2

I opt-out of the x-ray scanner every single time, and so should you. It really doesn't take much longer to go through the process. Show up 3 minutes earlier if you have to. You're rushing to the gate, for what? To sit there longer? Boarding with the crowds is stressful anyways. The most relaxed way to board is at the very end -- there's no more line, I just walk right into the plane, most people are seated, and just…

I noticed that not all security check points have the "naked" scanners, even at major airports you can find one security line at a lesser used security checkpoint that only has a standard metal detector. If goal is security, shouldn't all security lines have the scanners? Security is only as strong as the weakest link.

The bigger concern isn't the checkpoints inside the airpot, its the checkpoints on the roads to the airport. I want to know how the police can search my car without a warrant on a public road.

Re: Airport Security Is Killing Us

#40

Post by streptomycin » Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 7:19 PM UTC

citizens wrote: post #36

pavel_lishin wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I understand the situation is different if you really want your carry-on bag to stow above you. Or in the cabin. If you're the last to board, there's a very real possibility that they may have to gate-check your bag, which adds additional wait time at the end of your journey at best, and your bag arriving in Minnesota while you're touching down in Dallas at worst.

Which, of course, has become much more of a problem since the airlines started charging for checked bags/IRS made baggage fees tax-exempt. "...amounts paid for baggage services (such as Service G) are not subject to the tax" [ http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-wd/1002004.pdf ]

If all the overhead compartments are full and they have to check your carry-on, they won't charge you any fee, at least on the major US airlines I've flown on.