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Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

discuss.python.org

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Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#31

Post by davidkwast »

winrid wrote: post #13
davidkwast wrote: post #2

"Python 3.14 shipped with a new incremental garbage collector. However, we’ve had a number of reports of significant memory pressure in production environments. We’ve decided to revert it in both 3.14 and 3.15, and go back to the generational GC from 3.13." Sounds the right move for me

The main benefit of python to me is that while slow, it's predictable. I do think they're going to get a lot more resistance to adding JITs, moving GCs, etc. it will become java with a million knobs to tune. If people want a JIT'd python just use pypy, right?

It is the same for me. Predicability is better than any optimization.

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#33

Post by brian_herman »

sigmoid10 wrote: post #17
winrid wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main benefit of python to me is that while slow, it's predictable. I do think they're going to get a lot more resistance to adding JITs, moving GCs, etc. it will become java with a million knobs to tune. If people want a JIT'd python just use pypy, right?

And if people want python with java, there's always Jython.

Graal vm has support for python 3 unfortunately it’s funded by oracle.

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#34

Post by LaFolle »

athoscouto wrote: post #23

We've been impacted by this. I migrated our services to Python 3.14 so we could attach profilers during runtime. A couple of services looked like they had a memory leak. Memory was continuously increasing over time. Thanks to Python 3.14, we were able to use memray to understand what was going on. Those services were recreating HTTP clients (aiohttp) for every inbound request, and memory allocated by the downstream S…

On profilers - profiling will come in 3.15, are you referring to remote exec? It is a great feature I am very exited about, at the same time afraid that the company won’t allow ptrace capability in prod.

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#36

Post by mywittyname »

tdb7893 wrote: post #19
mau wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think humans are still accountable for the code generated by agents. You are free to switch language but you still need to understand it.

With a similar amount of experience with both languages I found Go much easier to read. I've always been a bit miffed why Python is seen as easy to read for experienced developers. I get the syntax is good for short code or people with little experience but my experience is those readability benefits went away quickly with time or complexity.

Why are you miffed about it? I legitimately hate reading golang with passion and find python to be pretty intuitive, outside of the odd ambitious list comprehensions. I worked in a golang shop for several years, so it's not just an familiarity situation either.

We are just different. That's not something to be mad about.

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#38

Post by __loam »

mywittyname wrote: post #36
tdb7893 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a similar amount of experience with both languages I found Go much easier to read. I've always been a bit miffed why Python is seen as easy to read for experienced developers. I get the syntax is good for short code or people with little experience but my experience is those readability benefits went away quickly with time or complexity.

Why are you miffed about it? I legitimately hate reading golang with passion and find python to be pretty intuitive, outside of the odd ambitious list comprehensions. I worked in a golang shop for several years, so it's not just an familiarity situation either. We are just different. That's not something to be mad about.

[flagged]

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#39

Post by Yokohiii »

mywittyname wrote: post #36
tdb7893 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a similar amount of experience with both languages I found Go much easier to read. I've always been a bit miffed why Python is seen as easy to read for experienced developers. I get the syntax is good for short code or people with little experience but my experience is those readability benefits went away quickly with time or complexity.

Why are you miffed about it? I legitimately hate reading golang with passion and find python to be pretty intuitive, outside of the odd ambitious list comprehensions. I worked in a golang shop for several years, so it's not just an familiarity situation either. We are just different. That's not something to be mad about.

In my opinion most interpreted languages today tend to produce very dense code. Fancy call chains and closures interleaving. If you look for a subtle bug those are hard to reason about, you have to know the details of a lot of different APIs.

Go is verbose partly for that reason, but a silly loop is a silly loop. The constraints are clear, you only have to do the logic.

Re: Reverting the incremental GC in Python 3.14 and 3.15

#40

Post by Yokohiii »

backwardation_b wrote: post #10
brianwawok wrote: post #9

In the world of AI written code, Python just doesn’t make sense. Converted about 100k lines in the last few months to golang and the performance is life changing. Curious if we will see global Python adoption fall by 75% or more in the next few years.

nothing about the performance characteristics of python changed with AI so why would you use python over golang if performance is a requirement/bottleneck? Trying to understand the reasoning as to me golang and python are equally simple to write and understand.

If language X is a persons comfort zone, that person will often default to it. Python is certainly more widespread then go.

Also, even if it looks like that to you, there are still people that write code with their own hands.

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