I see this kind of thing and have two reactions.
1. Wow! That's so cool!
2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
31–40 of 72 posts
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#32I see this kind of thing and have two reactions. 1. Wow! That's so cool! 2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
>2
My personal philosophy on this is that in the grand scheme of things, there is almost nothing that "really matters". So you might as well spend as much of your time as is reasonable doing something fun.
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#33I wonder how hard it would be to port it to the MiSTer, kinda surprised there isn't a core already for it. I guess it's not particularly useful.
EDIT: For anyone unfamiliar, the MiSTer is a homebrew FPGA project originally built around a Terasic DE-10 Nano that can emulate in hardware a wide variety of consoles and computers, leading to extremely low latency and (often) higher accuracy than most software emulators due to it being easier/more efficient to recreate cycle-accurate effects in hardware. It’s extremely flexible, allowing for both HDMI and analog output (with scaler effects, if desired), as well as both modern USB/Bluetooth HIDs as well as adapters for original controllers. It’s a very cool project and worth checking out if you’re enthusiastic about such things - retroremake.co has had some well-liked clone/re-engineerings of the MiSTer hardware but they’re going through a big shipping backlog so I don’t know when they’re in stock; there were some decently regarded Aliexpress clones as well, but I don’t know what the status of those is. An authentic DE-10 Nano is an option too, it’ll just be more expensive and you’ll still need to get an SDRAM board to run most cores.
Exactly the first thought I had too. I know extremely little about FPGA development, but three things I noticed that came to mind re: difficulty:
- Alex used a Xilinx FPGA, the MiSTer uses an Altera Cyclone - dunno how portable code (if that’s even the right term for e.g. VHDL) is from one to the other. I know the MiSTer has a light framework for cores to plug into to get input handling, scalers, etc.; so maybe it’s more a matter of porting to the framework…?
- Alex mentioned the SCC didn’t have a pre-made FPGA core so they used a real one. I don’t think serial handling would be critical but I do suspect you’d at least need a dummy to get the OS to pass self-tests and boot properly. Possible that maybe the Mac core has already handled this, though.
- What little I know of RAM and the MiSTer would lead me to think the SDRAM card a MiSTer setup typically needs wouldn’t be a problem over the SRAM Alex used, and that either the framework or the wiring of the RAM card handles the details for you - but I definitely don’t know that.
On the plus side I suspect/hope maybe a bunch of stuff from the classic/original Mac core could be borrowed to get it up and running.
There’s definitely plenty of cores that haven’t yet been developed on the MiSTer… for instance there isn’t a color 68K Mac core, only recently have people started on 3D0 and CD-i and Apple IIgs cores, the Saturn core was pretty shaky until a recent overhaul, etc. I think what’s there is just a function of what was either already developed for an FPGA or what had the biggest demand from their respective communities.
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#34I see this kind of thing and have two reactions. 1. Wow! That's so cool! 2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
It matters a lot... to them.
Is there anything better than to spend your time doing things that matter to you rather than needing some sort of external utility validation?
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#35I see this kind of thing and have two reactions. 1. Wow! That's so cool! 2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
Why doesn’t this project “really matter?”
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#36I see this kind of thing and have two reactions. 1. Wow! That's so cool! 2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
On 2, there's a surprising amount of very intelligent people that are really underutilized for all kinds of reasons.
Some don't like to sell themselves and compete.
Some have confidence issues.
Some have ADHD and an on-paper track record that looks terrible.
Some want nothing to do with corporate America.
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#37I see this kind of thing and have two reactions. 1. Wow! That's so cool! 2. Why didn't someone this smart spend that time to build something that really matters?
Why doesn’t this project “really matter?”
It matters a lot IMO, the Lisa is expensive and this is a good inexpensive way to preserve it
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
It was a fascinating idea - programs were hidden behind a document template metaphor. It was not as neat as Windows “New” menu and its templates folder.
> document template metaphor The macOS Finder has its own version of the Lisa's stationery feature: File > Get Info > Stationery Pad To make a document template folder, you mark your document templates as stationery. Then drag the template folder to the dock to get a pop-up template menu (or multiple menus if you wish).
Wow - I remember that from the System 7 days. I thought that was long gone - how did I not notice that checkbox was still there in Get Info this whole time?
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
What did Xenix did that was so distinctive?
It was a Unix. I believe the distinctive feature is not what it did, but what it didn’t - crash often.
There was another unix on the Lisa, i'd tell you more but there's literally nothing online about it and the only guy with copies of it hasn't responded to my letter. The company that made it dumped their Lisa unix stuff on him when they went bust because he sold lisa related stuff. Other than that tidbit of info, I haven't found anything online about it
Re: I recreated the Apple Lisa computer inside an FPGA [video]
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
Interesting. I used Apple II's in elementary school (early 1980's) and then some Macs but I had never even seen a Lisa in person until going to a computer museum about 5 years ago.
It was a fascinating idea - programs were hidden behind a document template metaphor. It was not as neat as Windows “New” menu and its templates folder.
This was the original desktop metaphor, from Xerox. I think it's pretty charming and enjoy playing around with it, but I can imagine getting real work™ done on it would get annoying quickly