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Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

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Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#31

Post by pjmlp »

boomskats wrote: post #24
pjmlp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet the WebAssembly bros are into replicating application servers with Kubernetes pods running WebAssembly containers, go figure.

I know right? Who wants sub-millisecond readiness, sub-second image replication and a measly couple of megs worth of memory alloc per service when everyone can just get themselves a 2 gig springboot heap by default? FWIW Wasm is hitting kubernetes because that's what customers are explicitly asking for, and the majority of enterprise Wasm-on-k8s afopters are doing so precisely because they want to eradicate Spring bl…

There are plenty of supply chain attacks without Spring into the picture.

Also, are you sure you are talking about Kubernetes performance over there?

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#32

Post by reactordev »

sgt wrote: post #30
reactordev wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>”latest Java technologies like Spring Boot.” Which are already old enough to drive… latest my ass.

I hear you, but there's genuine excitement still about Spring Boot and related technologies. See [1] Spring Cloud. [1] https://spring.io/projects/spring-cloud

Excitement is hardly the term I would use… it’s also old. It’s also outdated. Spring is done without corporate sponsorship or leadership. It died during the pivotal/vmware/handoff days.

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#33

Post by gadflyinyoureye »

bzzzt wrote: post #19
gadflyinyoureye wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spring won. Why would anyone want to learn the standard aside from it being a standard that few people use? Spring itself is a wildly adopted standard. It is a semi open standard in that anyone can use it freely, but in that it's not supposed to be implemented by others. The same is true for Micronaught or Quarkus. Learn the frameworks. But they are not a new open standard.

There's nothing to be gained by picking a winner, especially if it doesn't really matter because the important APIs are the same. Newer frameworks like Quarkus are specifically built for container usage and applications built with it are a bit faster and smaller than Spring boot.

I'm saying the spec lost to Spring. There are many historical reasons for the loss, but Spring won.

It looks like the industry is moving away from architectures like EE. The desire now is more like a Go deployment: single, self contained deployable. There are make frameworks that support this goal. Maybe EE is one of them, but it's not essential like it was in the early 2000s.

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#34

Post by kdazzle »

reactordev wrote: post #28
sgt wrote: post #7

Unfortunately the name Glassfish has been pretty tainted by now. If you say your platform is based on Glassfish they'll automatically assume you're an old donkey not up to date on latest Java technologies like Spring Boot.

>”latest Java technologies like Spring Boot.” Which are already old enough to drive… latest my ass.

Oh, I assumed that was a joke. I’ll have to check my privilege

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#36

Post by philipwhiuk »

When I see 'JEE Java application server', I always wonder:

* How many applications actually target multiple JEE servers

* Whether stuff like Glassfish and JBoss have to spend as much time selling the paradigm as the product

Personally speaking neither company I've worked out used JEE. We used Tomcat at the last place and the Play Framework at my current place.

I'm not sure that the benefits of long-running Java application servers that you can load and unload JAR-applications from exist (especially when unloading JARs has always been a mess).

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#38

Post by ondromih »

philipwhiuk wrote: post #36

When I see 'JEE Java application server', I always wonder: * How many applications actually target multiple JEE servers * Whether stuff like Glassfish and JBoss have to spend as much time selling the paradigm as the product Personally speaking neither company I've worked out used JEE. We used Tomcat at the last place and the Play Framework at my current place. I'm not sure that the benefits of long-running Java appli…

Jakarta EE gives a lot of options. It evolved.

Running an app server for a long time and redeploy apps to it is just one of them. To be honest, rarely used nowadays.

Many Jakarta EE products support:

* deploying apps on startup, just like Tomcat * bundling the server into a self-contained app, just like what SpringBoot does with Tomcat * running an app from command line, which Tomcat doesn't support - you have to drop the app into a predefined directory, SpringBoot doesn't support it either - the only option is to bundle the app and the server together during build

Some app servers are very lean, start in seconds, just like SpringBoot. Yeah, Tomcat starts faster, but only with a small app. If you add more libraries, you'd likely get to the same startup speed as SpringBoot or Embedded GlassFish.

I think the perception that JEE means big app servers where you deploy multiple apps and rarely restart the server, is very outdated. Nobody really uses Jakarta EE like that anymore. In fact, Jakarta EE is just APIs, the implementation can vary. Quarkus and Embedded GlassFish are perfect examples. Quarkus, although not fully Jakarta EE, can even build apps to native binaries. And Embedded GlassFish can run the same apps designed to run on app servers, on command line, without any installation of an app server.

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#39

Post by cess11 »

pvaldes wrote: post #12
fyrn_ wrote: post #2

Probably would be a good idea to include at least a single sentence somewhere near the top explaining what the heck a glass fish is.

> what the heck a glass fish is. In Biodiversity, a glass fish includes a few group of Asian fishes that show crystal transparent bodies to hide from predators. Specially when young. They are vertebrates that evolved transparent muscles. Two gens are kept in aquariums: Parambassis ranga and several ghost catfish from gen Kriptopterus. We can assume that the programmer likes aquariums. The word Yakarta is not random,…

Jakarta was chosen by the Eclipse Foundation because it is the largest city on the island of Java, and Oracle is virulently litigious around the Java trademark.

https://www.theregister.com/2018/03/04/java_ee_is_now_jakart...

Re: Eclipse GlassFish: This Isn't Your Father's GlassFish

#40

Post by mono442 »

sgt wrote: post #7

Unfortunately the name Glassfish has been pretty tainted by now. If you say your platform is based on Glassfish they'll automatically assume you're an old donkey not up to date on latest Java technologies like Spring Boot.

spring boot is almost as terrible as java ee if not even worse
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