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UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

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31–40 of 76 posts

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#31

So assuming one wanted to buy a used one of these (I had timex sinclairs around this time) how would one display the composite video nowdays?

I'm using a Pelco 9" PVM that had a former life as a security camera monitor. Suprisingly good video for composite, but alas its not very large.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#32

@UsagiElectric on YouTube has a series of videos on building a homebrew around the TMS9900 processor. Would be cool if a unix-like OS could be used on something like that, though sounds like this project is specifically targeting the TI-99/4A system. The TI-99/4A was the first computer I owned as a teenager. I had used TRS-80s and Apple ][ at school. I eventually bought the expansion box and a couple of accessory car…

TI-99/4A was my first computer as well. I still have two of them, and they still work as well as they did in the '80s. I graduated to an Apple ][GS which I still have as well, although it needs some TLC before attempting to boot it so as not to let out the magic smoke.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#34
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, but it lacks a MMU so memory protection and paging are going to require a lot of work. I think the only reason this is feasible at all is they're running the OS out of a ROM cartridge.

Did the minicomputers of the time have MMUs? I thought UsagiElectric showed a case where his Centurion didn’t, but I may be misremembering.

In fact the 9900 itself was used in an entire line of minicomputers that included a hardware memory map.

The 9900 is a single chip implementation of the CPU board in the TI 990. They even created a dedicated memory mapper chip to go along with the product line, though it is significantly different than the one in the minicomputer line.

(edit: the 990 was first built in the early 70s, memory mappers are quite old conceptually)

(edit 2: in fact the necessity of using a memory mapper is what killed the platform, and was one of the things that made the IBM PC team decline the 9900.)

Unfortunately I don't think that there is a reasonable way to perform real hardware-level memory protection with that chip alone. I'm working on a project documenting the genesis of the 99000 chips, which include a privilege bit in the status register, from the minicomputer line.

Essay forthcoming, and probably an OS. Maybe a year...

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, but it lacks a MMU so memory protection and paging are going to require a lot of work. I think the only reason this is feasible at all is they're running the OS out of a ROM cartridge.

The PDP machines that Unix was developed on had MMUs, which they needed because the 16 bit processors couldn't address the multi-megabyte address space the hardware supported. I'm pretty sure the Centurion doesn't run Unix.

The PDP-10 had an MMU similar to a modern MMU with page tables and such, the PDP-11 had an 8-segment-of-8kb MMU like what the TRS-80 Color Computer 3 had except the PDP-11 had a real supervisor mode and if a user mode program tried to change the MMU configuration it would fault.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#36

@UsagiElectric on YouTube has a series of videos on building a homebrew around the TMS9900 processor. Would be cool if a unix-like OS could be used on something like that, though sounds like this project is specifically targeting the TI-99/4A system. The TI-99/4A was the first computer I owned as a teenager. I had used TRS-80s and Apple ][ at school. I eventually bought the expansion box and a couple of accessory car…

My parents bought one for the house when I was in elementary school. I still remember the sound of the Speech Synthesizer, discovering 20 GOTO 10, and playing Hunt the Wumpus.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#37
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did the minicomputers of the time have MMUs? I thought UsagiElectric showed a case where his Centurion didn’t, but I may be misremembering.

In fact the 9900 itself was used in an entire line of minicomputers that included a hardware memory map. The 9900 is a single chip implementation of the CPU board in the TI 990. They even created a dedicated memory mapper chip to go along with the product line, though it is significantly different than the one in the minicomputer line. (edit: the 990 was first built in the early 70s, memory mappers are quite old conc…

One chip that could be used as a memory mapper for the 9900 (but wasn't in the TI99/4A) was the 74LS670, which was used in the IBM 5150 PC to allow the 8237 DMA chip to access more than 64KB (a limit that wasn't a problem when used in a 8080 system).

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#38
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the CPU is a better fit than the 8 bit contemporaries, the 16kb of working memory is going to be a struggle.

It's cool because the registers are all in RAM, with a "workspace pointer" on the CPU pointing at where they are. This is slow, but a context switch is just changing that pointer.

It's not all that slow as a concept at that time when RAM speeds were as fast as CPU speeds. I think it's just that TI's implementation of the concept in that particular cost-optimised home computer was pretty bad -- the actual registers were in 256 bytes of fast static RAM, but the rest of the system memory (both ROM and RAM) was accessed very inefficiently, not only 1 bytes at a time on a 16 bit machine, but also with something like 4 wait states for every byte.

The 6502 is not very different with a very small number of registers and Zero Page being used for most of what a modern machine would use registers for. For example (unlike the Z80) there is no register-to-register add or subtract or compare -- you can only add/sub/cmp/and/or/xor a memory location to the accumulator. Also, pointers can only be done using a pair of adjacent Zero Page locations.

As long as you were using data in those in-RAM registers the TI-99/4 was around four times faster than a 1 MHz 6502 for 16 bit arithmetic -- and with a single 2-byte instruction doing what needed 7 instructions and 13 bytes of code on 6502 -- and it was also twice as fast on 8 bit arithmetic.

It was just the cheap-ass main memory (and I/O) implementation that crippled it.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#39

@UsagiElectric on YouTube has a series of videos on building a homebrew around the TMS9900 processor. Would be cool if a unix-like OS could be used on something like that, though sounds like this project is specifically targeting the TI-99/4A system. The TI-99/4A was the first computer I owned as a teenager. I had used TRS-80s and Apple ][ at school. I eventually bought the expansion box and a couple of accessory car…

Same, though I bought one off Facebook marketplace recently- minus the expansion box. Lots of memories learning programming and the explosively better 'Extended Basic' vs the built in version.

Re: UNIX99, a UNIX-like OS for the TI-99/4A (2025)

#40

So assuming one wanted to buy a used one of these (I had timex sinclairs around this time) how would one display the composite video nowdays?

A USB video capture device or a converter box. There are devices sold specifically to interface these old machines with modern displays. One of the more famous ones is the RetroTINK.

Yep, I have an HDMI converter box that works great I got off eBay.
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