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BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

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31–40 of 79 posts

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#31

This feels like they want to use trademark law to prevent third-party products. You can't legally produce the screws without baiscally copying the BMW logo onto it. I don't know if a similar argument would hold water for the drivers though.

This is also why a lot of car bumpers have the make/model/logo impressed into the mold itself

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearly zero chance of them doing that at production volumes though.

Why not? A properly set up CNC machining center would turn those out by the bucketload. That's precisely the sort of thing that BMW does regularly with exterior details, no reason why they couldn't do it for a batch of bolts.

You can make anything on anything. Doesn't make it smart tho.

If this were a production run of a few dozen super high grade aerospace donkey dicks with five shoulders and four pockets, an oil channel, a precisely engineered break point and a 12-step heat treat process I'd say yeah, make it on your Swiss lathe with live tooling or bajillion axis VMC or whatever.

But this looks to be a simple small, probably cosmetic or otherwise low-ish strength stainless or chromed fastener that BMW probably wants a few hundred thousand of. You'll be time, money, labor, frustration, managerial nitpicking, just about everything, ahead to just have the fastener industry and their existing expertise make it for you. The "bespoke" drive, the custom branding, those are all known-knowns to those guys. They'll whip up tooling for their screw machines and fill the same bucket in 1/20th of the time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJvQZko8uiU

Edit: replaced video link with better one. Obviously there's fiddle fucking around they're not showing and they're mix and matching footage of different products but the speed things move once you've got it all set up is broadly accurate. A whole bunch of these steps would be skipped or altered for a stainless fastener.

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearly zero chance of them doing that at production volumes though.

Why not? A properly set up CNC machining center would turn those out by the bucketload. That's precisely the sort of thing that BMW does regularly with exterior details, no reason why they couldn't do it for a batch of bolts.

You don't use CNC for making a billion individual screws. These would have their heads formed by being stamped in a die, just like phillips, robertson, security torx or any other screw heads.

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#34

I'd be interested to know how BMW manufactures those screws. The patterns in the metal in the image suggest the entire hole was drilled out? The deepest part has circular marks inside that looks like the marks left by a facing tool on a lathe or similar. Then I guess the two wedges were inserted and the whole screw faced?

Unlike all the other guesses here, I actually do have experience with manufacturing specialty aerospace fasteners similar in size, shape, complexity, and precision as these. These are most assuredly being manufactured on a specialty tool called a “Swissing Lathe”, or Swiss CNC machine, because that is the machine you always use to make parts like this. It is a multi-headed turret mill combined with a lathe that can continuously feed a piece of long bar stock and continually spit out fasteners. They were invented many years ago to produce extremely high precision small screws for watches, and in fact Citizen is one of the main vendors of these tools to this day. Based on my experience I would expect the cycle time for making this part to be 30 seconds or so.

Here’s a good video that eli5’s the difference between a Swiss screw machine and conventional CNC.

https://youtu.be/y3y0tATB0lg?si=pkYDT3BV0-6C-aq5

And here’s a video with a high quality soundtrack that shows how the machine combines automatic lathe cuts, mill cuts, and thread rolling without changing machines, swapping cutters, or re-fixturing the work.

https://youtu.be/MPAK5I1HJAw?si=fnMmjDp6ydYSDbfH

And if you need some specialty fasteners made and have an unlimited budget I can reccomed these folks.

https://centrix-us.com/

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#35

Correct bit for screwdriver available on AliExpress 5 minutes after the bolt is available for public.

And that would violate both BMWs Trademark and Patent, which at least in Switzerland could mean having to pay BMW damages and get fined for importing counterfeit goods.

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#36

BMW: The Ultimate Asshole Machine.. now with more assholery to assholes too! (Their motorcycles had a better rep until now.)

I suppose that depends on your definition of “now”. BMW has had a 20 year history of fork lower failures on their adventure bikes. Just search “BMW Fork Failure” and you will find a lot of discussion. Here was a Microsoft friend’s wreck in Alaska, which I believe was one of the earliest ones. Front wheel complete separated while she was riding straight and level on a paved road.

https://www.advrider.com/f/threads/crash-in-destruction-bay-...

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#37

I'd be interested to know how BMW manufactures those screws. The patterns in the metal in the image suggest the entire hole was drilled out? The deepest part has circular marks inside that looks like the marks left by a facing tool on a lathe or similar. Then I guess the two wedges were inserted and the whole screw faced?

For prototypes, almost certainly with a CNC lathe. For a large scale production, I would expect them to drop forge these...

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#38
Reminds me of the 2-hole "snake eye" or "pig nose" screw heads you sometimes see in bathrooms or elevators. I have several of the bits for these since they come with every one of those n>20 -piece screwdriver bit sets, but I've never actually had to undo one. I guess that goes for most of the oddball bits those sets come with.

If they really wanted to screw (pun, sorry) with repairability (and at significant cost to themselves), I guess they could start making their own taps and dies for nonstandard threads you can't buy anywhere else. Wouldn't stop them from being unscrewed, though.

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#39
post #35

Correct bit for screwdriver available on AliExpress 5 minutes after the bolt is available for public.

And that would violate both BMWs Trademark and Patent, which at least in Switzerland could mean having to pay BMW damages and get fined for importing counterfeit goods.

good thing that it would be a chinese copy, and thus, not subject to switzerland law. So i wonder if chinese law recognize this patent/trademark for a screw?

Re: BMW's Newest "Innovation" Is a Logo-Shaped Middle Finger to Right to Repair

#40
post #8
post #5

BMW resale values make it very clear: these cars are actively hostile (in many many ways) to their owners the second they go out of warranty. Pity, their interiors are lovely. In the long term, is this strategy going to work out for them? I won't buy another one. I know... anecdata :)

A friend of mine used to buy the first model of any new and hot BMW. He'd know the specs better than the sales people and he spent a fortune on them. They also spent more time in the shop with electrical gremlins than any car that I've ever seen. One of our employees insisted on a Mini, which is also BMW as their lease car. No other car we had had that much trouble. BMW is a crap brand that used to make very good car…

> Neither of these will survive in the longer term

German government will do everything possible to prevent these companies from failing, no matter how bad the situation gets. This means that current management can simply apply the "next quarter" strategy without any realistic downside.

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