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X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

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Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#31

Post by chrisjj »

lava_pidgeon wrote: post #28
chrisjj wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> CSAM does not have a universal definition. Strange that there was no disagreement before "AI", right? Yet now we have a clutch of new "definitions" all of which dilute and weaken the meaning. > In Sweden for instance, CSAM is any image of an underage subject (real or realistic digital) designed to evoke a sexual response. No corroboration found on web. Quite the contrary, in fact: "Sweden does not have a legislativ…

" Strange that there was no disagreement before "AI", right? Yet now we have a clutch of new "definitions" all of which dilute and weaken the meaning. " Are you from Sweden? Why do you think the definition was clear across the world and not changed "before AI"? Or is it some USDefaultism where Americans assume their definition was universal?

> Are you from Sweden?

No. I used this interweb thing to fetch that document from Sweden, saving me a 1000-mile walk.

> Why do you think the definition was clear across the world and not changed "before AI"?

I didn't say it was clear. I said there was no disagreement.

And I said that because I saw only agreement. CSAM == child sexual abuse material == a record of child sexual abuse.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#32

Post by bonesss »

afavour wrote: post #23
cbeach wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when notified, doing nothing about it When notified, he immediately: * "implemented technological measures to prevent the Grok account from allowing the editing of images of real people in revealing clothing" - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8gz8g2qnlo * locked image generation down to paid accounts only (i.e. those individuals that can be identified via their payment details). Have the other AI companies fo…

You and I must have different definitions of the word “immediately”. The article you posted is from January 15th. Here is a story from January 2nd: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c98p1r4e6m8o > Have the other AI companies followed suit? They were also allowing users to undress real people No they weren’t? There were numerous examples of people feeding the same prompts to different AIs and having their requests ref…

The part of X’s reaction to their own publishing I’m most looking forward to seeing in slow-motion in the courts and press was their attempt at agency laundering by having their LLM generate an apology in first-person.

“Sorry I broke the law. Oops for reals tho.”

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#33

Post by tokai »

vessenes wrote: post #9

Interesting. This is basically the second enforcement on speech / images that France has done - first was Pavel Durov @ Telegram. He eventually made changes in Telegram's moderation infrastructure and I think was allowed to leave France sometime last year. I don't love heavy-handed enforcement on speech issues, but I do really like a heterogenous cultural situation, so I think it's interesting and probably to the ove…

In what world is generating CSAM a speech issue? Its really doing a disservice to actual free speech issues to frame it was such.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#34

Post by antonymoose »

techblueberry wrote: post #25
cbeach wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

In November 2012, Epstein sent Musk an email asking “how many people will you be for the heli to island”. “Probably just Talulah and me. What day/night will be the wildest party on your island?” Musk replied, in an apparent reference to his former wife Talulah Riley. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2026/jan/30/elon-musk... I think there's just as much evidence Clinton did as Musk. Gates on the other hand.

To my knowledge Musk asked to go but never actually went. Clinton, however, went a dozen or so times with Epstein on his private jet?

Has the latest release changed that narrative?

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#36

Post by logicchains »

vessenes wrote: post #9

Interesting. This is basically the second enforcement on speech / images that France has done - first was Pavel Durov @ Telegram. He eventually made changes in Telegram's moderation infrastructure and I think was allowed to leave France sometime last year. I don't love heavy-handed enforcement on speech issues, but I do really like a heterogenous cultural situation, so I think it's interesting and probably to the ove…

>but I do really like a heterogenous cultural situation, so I think it's interesting and probably to the overall good to have a country pushing on these matters very hard

Censorship increases homogeneity, because it reduces the amount of ideas and opinions that are allowed to be expressed. The only resilience that comes from restricting people's speech is resilience of the people in power.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#37

Post by tokai »

chrisjj wrote: post #12
mortarion wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CSAM does not have a universal definition. In Sweden for instance, CSAM is any image of an underage subject (real or realistic digital) designed to evoke a sexual response. If you take a picture of a 14 year old girl (age of consent is 15) and use Grok to give her bikini, or make her topless, then you are most definately producing and possessing CSAM. No abuse of a real minor is needed.

> CSAM does not have a universal definition. Strange that there was no disagreement before "AI", right? Yet now we have a clutch of new "definitions" all of which dilute and weaken the meaning. > In Sweden for instance, CSAM is any image of an underage subject (real or realistic digital) designed to evoke a sexual response. No corroboration found on web. Quite the contrary, in fact: "Sweden does not have a legislativ…

"Sweden does not have a legislative definition of child sexual abuse material (CSAM)"

Because that is up to the courts to interpret. You cant use your common law experience to interpret the law in other countries.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#38

Post by StopDisinfo910 »

vessenes wrote: post #9

Interesting. This is basically the second enforcement on speech / images that France has done - first was Pavel Durov @ Telegram. He eventually made changes in Telegram's moderation infrastructure and I think was allowed to leave France sometime last year. I don't love heavy-handed enforcement on speech issues, but I do really like a heterogenous cultural situation, so I think it's interesting and probably to the ove…

Very different charges however.

Durov was held on suspicion Telegram was willingly failing to moderate its platform and allowed drug trafficking and other illegal activities to take place.

X has allegedly illegally sent data to the US in violation of GDPR and contributed to child porn distribution.

Note that both are directly related to direct violation of data safety law or association with a separate criminal activities, neither is about speech.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#39

Post by logicchains »

tokai wrote: post #33
vessenes wrote: post #9

Interesting. This is basically the second enforcement on speech / images that France has done - first was Pavel Durov @ Telegram. He eventually made changes in Telegram's moderation infrastructure and I think was allowed to leave France sometime last year. I don't love heavy-handed enforcement on speech issues, but I do really like a heterogenous cultural situation, so I think it's interesting and probably to the ove…

In what world is generating CSAM a speech issue? Its really doing a disservice to actual free speech issues to frame it was such.

The point of banning real CSAM is to stop the production of it, because the production is inherently harmful. The production of AI or human generated CSAM-like images does not inherently require the harm of children, so it's fundamentally a different consideration. That's why some countries, notably Japan, allow the production of hand-drawn material that in the US would be considered CSAM.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#40

Post by fmbb »

chrisjj wrote: post #12
mortarion wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CSAM does not have a universal definition. In Sweden for instance, CSAM is any image of an underage subject (real or realistic digital) designed to evoke a sexual response. If you take a picture of a 14 year old girl (age of consent is 15) and use Grok to give her bikini, or make her topless, then you are most definately producing and possessing CSAM. No abuse of a real minor is needed.

> CSAM does not have a universal definition. Strange that there was no disagreement before "AI", right? Yet now we have a clutch of new "definitions" all of which dilute and weaken the meaning. > In Sweden for instance, CSAM is any image of an underage subject (real or realistic digital) designed to evoke a sexual response. No corroboration found on web. Quite the contrary, in fact: "Sweden does not have a legislativ…

> - in any current law.

It has been since at least 2012 here in Sweden. That case went to our highest court and they decided a manga drawing was CSAM (maybe you are hung up on this term though, it is obviously not the same in Swedish).

The holder was not convicted but that is besides the point about the material.

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