Heres what happened ..
A bunch of folks who were born into wealth and who vote Republican criticized the program as socialism since they believed that everyone should pull themselves by their bootstraps just as they did by being born into money. If you havent, well systems dont work for everybody so its tragic but helping people institutionally is socialism and nothing not even homelessness is worse.
Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
31–40 of 108 posts
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#32So if you give people money they'll endeavor to tell you precisely what they think you want to hear. I would be much more impressed if this wasn't based solely on self-reported results.
I agree, further study is warranted. They should do it again with a larger cohort for longer and with more objective measures.
Larger and larger until we're just flat out testing UBI is fine by me. If you want to test UBI, there's no better way than implementing UBI.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#33> Based on responses from about half of the program’s participants
That "responses" is a link to the actual report.
1. The program was 120 people. 80 did an initial survey, 80 did a final survey, and there was an overlap is 60 who did both surveys. The survey was offered to all participants.
So, this is not a random / representative sample.
2. The program also included counseling sessions.
So, there's the potential for different results for money without counseling, or counseling without money.
3. I don't see any comparison to a control group.
For example, it's well known that homelessness is usually transitory. Without a control group, there's nothing to identify what was caused by the program vs being caused by the usual course of things.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#34Libertarians who want the impoverished to "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" don't realize what that takes. Nobody deserves to live without a home. We need successes like these so that as many people as possible can get assistance.
It's also wild just how cost-effective interventions like this can be. You can pay a thousand here and there, or a few hundred thousand incarcerating these people when they turn to crime out of desperation.
Totally agree. I don't want to pay taxes that go to social programs but the reality is if we don't find effective policies I end up paying more in taxes for emergency treatment and society take major economic hits for the other secondary problems, like crime, that homelessness causes. Of course the other argument for this is that society clearly has a hand in the path that took these people to where they are at now so society has some responsibility. Both are reasons to support well researched evidence based policy decisions to deal with the problem.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#35Libertarians who want the impoverished to "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" don't realize what that takes. Nobody deserves to live without a home. We need successes like these so that as many people as possible can get assistance.
It's also wild just how cost-effective interventions like this can be. You can pay a thousand here and there, or a few hundred thousand incarcerating these people when they turn to crime out of desperation.
Yeah but then you cant pay Palantir to throw their "advanced" data analytics engine at the problem. And who will fund the military industrial complex that does the important job of defending the people of America from external threats that are absolutely totally coming for you.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#36I like the idea of helping people out of poverty. But the problem with government funded charities is they are so ripe for fraud, they almost never get managed properly.
Most people in a tech business can easily identify a whale hunt. That is, a business where a small number of customers provide such a disproportionate share of revenue that everyone else doesn't matter. But for some reason they fail to see government spending fraud is in fact a whale hunt.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#37Consider reading the full final report here: https://static1.squarespace.com/static/60418acae851e139836c6... Contains significantly more information and exact statistics.
Unfortunately it looks like the headline numbers may not be representative:
“The research team did not initially receive a complete participant contact list and the CBO staff led in facilitating recruitment, resulting in a sample that does not represent all DCT+ participants. The limited sample size further limits the representativeness and generalizability of findings. The evaluation sample of 63 participants represents only 54% of the total 117 program participants. Therefore, the study population may not adequately represent the broader DCT+ experience. Additionally, participants who completed both initial and exit surveys may differ systematically from those who did not, potentially skewing results toward more positive outcomes among individuals who remained engaged throughout the evaluation period.”
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#38I like the idea of helping people out of poverty. But the problem with government funded charities is they are so ripe for fraud, they almost never get managed properly.
I say we first ensure that fraudsters be not placed in government positions, and then worry more about eradicating the lesser fraud in charities that receive some funding from the government.
OP's comment is just hilarious on too many levels. "I like X, but...", so let's not even try. No evidence for the claim, either. And all while failing to see the bigger picture.
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#39I like the idea of helping people out of poverty. But the problem with government funded charities is they are so ripe for fraud, they almost never get managed properly.
Like the Whitehouse?
Re: Oregon gave homeless youth $1k/month with no strings
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is a myth, actual fraud rates on programs like this are tiny - especially if you compare them to the benefits.
Fraud rates on benefits are also absurdly low.
I read that more that the benefits society gets from lifting people from poverty as opposed to the food stamps benefits you seem to have in mind.