Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

raku.land

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 49 posts

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#31

Post by ErroneousBosh »

zabzonk wrote: post #12
cmwelsh wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China disregards that and there is an absolutely massive ecosystem of Free and Open Source Software out there if you can read and write their code.

I know little about china (except i like the food and art) but do they actually write code in their native language(s)?!

The first STM32 "bluepill"-based SCSI to SD adaptor I ever used had all its source code in Chinese.

Google Translate did a not terrible job of turning all the comments into English but also mangled the code in exciting new ways, but with a bit of ingenuity to apply the Artificial Intelligence translations, and a bit of bloodymindedness when applying the Analogue Idiocy to hacking it all about with search-and-replace, I got a pretty plausible translation of it.

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#32

Post by p4bl0 »

benrutter wrote: post #5

This is neat! People who like this might be interested in the awesome Hedy language[0]. It's purpose is education, but it's a single programming language with lots of localisations. Always suprised this idea isn't pursued more elsewhere. [0] https://www.hedy.org/

This is a nice idea but while the home page was correctly localized in French as my browser is, I couldn't find a way to see "teaching" or "learning" parts of the website in French. At least on mobile, there's no way to tell the site to change language, and it doesn't properly do that on its own based on the browser's preferences. This defeats the whole idea…

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#35

Post by librasteve »

B1FIDO wrote: post #30
zabzonk wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i've always given the advice "program in english, comments, variables, function names, everything", and "always use a uk/us keyboard unless you absolutely have to enter localised strings, and even better get someone else to do that"

The smart projects that are going for L10N will collect all the UI strings into a file or set of files, separate from the code, and indexed so that the app can just switch language and then begin using a new set of localized strings. This also makes for easy translation where you don't need to rebuild the app, just expand the data files that it's using. Is this not the only way to build apps today, or are "localized…

Draig is built on L10N and code can be passed to/from Welsh Other (eg English) … the keywords are translated back and forth, but comments and identifiers are whatever the coder writes.

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#36

Post by librasteve »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #18
zabzonk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know little about china (except i like the food and art) but do they actually write code in their native language(s)?!

I can only speak for Japan, but I suspect China is the same. In Japan, English programming is the norm because all mainstream programming languages are written in English. Keywords, libraries and documentation are in English, so there's not really any getting around the fact that you have to learn to read at least some English. Some Japanese developers do write identifiers in Japanese where languages support it, and…

how about https://raku.land/zef:l10n/L10N::JA ?

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#37

Post by fooker »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #29
fooker wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coming soon to a programming ecosystem near you: LLM(eat apples in fruitbasket) vs foreach (apple in fruitbasket) apple.Eat() Your comment can be repeated almost word for word here.

Not at all. I'm comparing two different syntaxes that can reliably compile to the same machine code. A syntax that produces non-deterministic results is a completely different matter.

> non-deterministic

You can control the amount of non determinism.

And also, it is interesting that you think modern compilers are deterministic.

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#39

Post by anonymous908213 »

fooker wrote: post #37
anonymous908213 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. I'm comparing two different syntaxes that can reliably compile to the same machine code. A syntax that produces non-deterministic results is a completely different matter.

> non-deterministic You can control the amount of non determinism. And also, it is interesting that you think modern compilers are deterministic.

Please do not engage in bad-faith arguments centered around pedantry. You know very well what I mean.

Re: Draig, a Welsh Programming Language

#40

Post by fooker »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #39
fooker wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> non-deterministic You can control the amount of non determinism. And also, it is interesting that you think modern compilers are deterministic.

Please do not engage in bad-faith arguments centered around pedantry. You know very well what I mean.

I know what you mean, and it was correct a year or more ago. Now, you are wrong.

AI is reliable enough to not mess up this translation now, especially if you configure it right (top p, and temperature parameters).

This abstraction lifting is absolutely happening in front of our eyes now. For the exact same reason the C for loop is less readable.

The different is that you don't yet store the prompts, just the generated code. That difference is not going to last too long. Storing prompts and contexts along with generated code is likely how we are going to be doing software engineering for a few decades before whatever the next leap in technology works out to be.

Post reply on HN