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The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

lemonde.fr

31–40 of 71 posts

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#31

Yeah and if you make US median income you’re in the top 0.3% of worldwide income. I don’t see all these people giving away to the bottom 99.7%, hahaha.

I'm not sure that's actually all that relevant. Political power and social class are much more determined by the wealth distribution within a society than they are by the worldwide wealth distribution.

It is and it isn't. Relative wealth within society has consequences regardless of absolute wealth. But globally power is absolutely shaped by wealth distribution as well, as wealth distribution is influenced by power relations too.

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#32
The question is where this will lead and what, if anything will, should or can be done to put the brakes on this wealth (re-)distribution.

It feels as though over the last few decades, all we have seen is a continuing trend of increasing amounts of wealth being amassed by a smaller and smaller circle of people.

What I find incredibly hard to judge is the point at which the current system leading to this will face violent reorganisation.

We've had feudalism, communism and fascism (and even a few attempts at egalitarian democracies long before that), but they all failed. It is tempting to say they all failed because "they could have never worked". That's easy to say with hindsight.

Once the current experiment implodes, will we all be armchair experts, scoffing at the idea that this could have ever worked also? And if so, why isn't anyone looking at the system and trying to change something?

The other systems usually ended in world wars or violent revolution. Often the ruling class became too comfortable / belligerent, just to then be replaced by the same thing (but maybe with a bit of lag. See the 2nd world war's ending. The middle class thrived up until about the 70s/80s).

Would feudalism have stayed if they'd had the levels of surveillance and AI-powered control we are currently facing? How about communism? Could a planned economy work if that is suddenly super-charged with computers and AI (and the necessary oppression to achieve it)?

Capitalism mixed with strong safeguards ensuring that there is a return for productivity for everyone feels like the best attempt we've made at a system that works for everyone until all the safeguards began being dismantled in the 70s.

Can we return to that system or is regulatory capture irreversible and therefore capitalism will always inevitably lead back to feudalism? And what can be done about it once AI and automation ensure the hegemony can't be touched anymore?

I have no answers, only questions...

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem isn’t necessarily the wealth itself, it’s the power feedback loop that comes with it. It’s the ability to influence the government to pass laws which maintain or amplify your existing wealth, which then increases your influence, etc. There is nothing “free market” about this. There is no equitable or efficient destitution of resources when this kind of thing happens - and it will always happen, because it…

you are right that wealth increases power. that may be a problem. but i don't think redistribution can materially make people's lives better.

Government funding for public services does very much improve peoples lives and you cant ignore the current wealth distribution, when you want to tap into "new" sources of income/taxation.

How could you miss these 2 elephants?

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#34

The question is where this will lead and what, if anything will, should or can be done to put the brakes on this wealth (re-)distribution. It feels as though over the last few decades, all we have seen is a continuing trend of increasing amounts of wealth being amassed by a smaller and smaller circle of people. What I find incredibly hard to judge is the point at which the current system leading to this will face vio…

Massive taxation of ultra rich (50%+) after WW2 in USA

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you are right that wealth increases power. that may be a problem. but i don't think redistribution can materially make people's lives better.

Government funding for public services does very much improve peoples lives and you cant ignore the current wealth distribution, when you want to tap into "new" sources of income/taxation. How could you miss these 2 elephants?

New sources of income will inevitably be the money printer.

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#36

The question is where this will lead and what, if anything will, should or can be done to put the brakes on this wealth (re-)distribution. It feels as though over the last few decades, all we have seen is a continuing trend of increasing amounts of wealth being amassed by a smaller and smaller circle of people. What I find incredibly hard to judge is the point at which the current system leading to this will face vio…

> Capitalism mixed with strong safeguards ensuring that there is a return for productivity for everyone feels like the best attempt we've made at a system that works for everyone until all the safeguards began being dismantled in the 70s.

You mean when the US left the gold standard and began a 50 year period of inflationary money printing?

That same inflation is a direct transfer of wealth to the asset class, and a hidden tax on the working class.

> Can we return to that system

Not directly. There is zero chance that the US can return to the gold standard, but they could lose their position as the world currency and be replaced by something that is resistant to inflation.

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political power and social class don't feed hungry people.

Overeating now kills more people than hunger, it just flipped somewhat recently.

Yet both can be at alarmingly high rates at the same time, it's not like one cancels the other out

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#38
If you take any ancient or not so ancient civilization or kingdom, all the wealth including land and people's lives belonged to king/imperator which was appointed by god or something like that.

Isn't is exactly the same with the system we have now?

The question we have to ask is about 99% of population of peasants who work 8h a day same as they did in Mesopotamia. Do they have a living standard, healthcare, possibility to have social bonds, possibility to retire. Basically all the things to have a life.

If peasants are able to have all this, I really don't care if some King of ours has 20 trillion or 50 bazillion. In money or in gold.

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Government funding for public services does very much improve peoples lives and you cant ignore the current wealth distribution, when you want to tap into "new" sources of income/taxation. How could you miss these 2 elephants?

New sources of income will inevitably be the money printer.

And where do you think the indefinitly raising wealth of the top 10% comes from?

I think you should look into modern monetary theory, MMT.

Re: The ultra-rich are claiming an increasing share of global wealth

#40

If you take any ancient or not so ancient civilization or kingdom, all the wealth including land and people's lives belonged to king/imperator which was appointed by god or something like that. Isn't is exactly the same with the system we have now? The question we have to ask is about 99% of population of peasants who work 8h a day same as they did in Mesopotamia. Do they have a living standard, healthcare, possibili…

So the past was shitty too? You don't care? Okay, well some of us do.

Wealth grants power. Opinions from money matter gain greater reach and traction, and these very quickly turn into influence and power. The current US administration clearly shows how wielding power for your own ends gives you money. It's a toxic cycle that rewards grift instead of work.

You don't care, but this is a serious problem for society because it's a negative aspiration. Don't be good, don't try hard, just be rich or die a peasant.

But the peasants have limited appetites for gruel and work when all they see is grift and abuse. They revolted until old money stopped stopped demanding fealty. Will the new masters learn before we peasants eat the rich?

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