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Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

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Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#31

Post by radley »

twism wrote: post #26
radley wrote: post #12

The author seems to be stuck in 2011 when device UIs were rough, behind the curve, and the promise of a pure Android device would save the platform. The "second rate" Galaxy S3 is now massively outselling the Nexus and is the only Android device to outsell iPhones last summer.

It's just marketing. IMO, the GSIII is not a bad device, but pure nexus with Jelly Bean from google (hspda+ version, not the verzion nexus which should not be called a nexus device) is the best android (or any mobile OS) experience.

That's just opinion. I have 2 stock JB Nexus devices and yetprefer to use my GS3. If the sims were the same size I would use both since JB has the better voice stuff right now.

My point is numbers don't lie. The author laments the GS3 as second rate yet it's clearly the most in-demand device. The author is either deluded, had writers block (and dredged up an old premise), or hoped this might be a popular new link-bait topic.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#32

Post by twism »

blinkingled wrote: post #28

1) True Android is the one that runs Android apps - difference in glow or purity not counted. They run, it's Android. 2) You cannot force your definitions of Android on people to get them to buy "the one true Android". People buy what they like. They like the S3 better than the Nexus. Talk about different priorities. S3 is starting to get the Jelly Bean update too. 3) There is something called emphasis in good design…

Android isn't just about apps. From utilities like Google Now, to aesthetics like resizable widgets. The android experience isn't waiting for your carrier to update your phone when folks with nexus devices are getting updates a couple of days after the update is announced. S3 might be getting updates but I doubt US owners will see one this year.

Why can't we get iPhone-esque build quality of the One X with regular updates and purity of the nexus?

I say manufactures should leave the customizations to the users, focus on hardware, and getting timely updates to the phone.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#33

Post by radley »

elcogote wrote: post #15
Zigurd wrote: post #11

The article contains a common error: "Every iPhone comes with iOS exactly as Steve Jobs intended, which means developers know precisely what they’re getting." On Android, that's not the problem. All Androids, as uglified by OEM add-ons as they might be, are highly compatible with applications. All Androids running the same API level of Android, even the Kindle Fire, run all the applications that use those APIs. There…

>The problem is that "customized" Androids are hard to upgrade. Why are they so hard to upgrade?

It was more difficult to go from 2.x to 4.0. In between was 3.0 which is essentially a tablet-only showcase OS - it didn't work on phones. That made 2011-2012 seem like an eternity for devices to get back into the upgrade cycle. And by the time devices could be upgraded it was clear most of them weren't powerful enough to make the leap.

It's very different now. If you buy a standard Android smart phone (not a low end / small screen device) it will be much faster and easier to receive updates.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#34

Post by blinkingled »

twism wrote: post #32
blinkingled wrote: post #28

1) True Android is the one that runs Android apps - difference in glow or purity not counted. They run, it's Android. 2) You cannot force your definitions of Android on people to get them to buy "the one true Android". People buy what they like. They like the S3 better than the Nexus. Talk about different priorities. S3 is starting to get the Jelly Bean update too. 3) There is something called emphasis in good design…

Android isn't just about apps. From utilities like Google Now, to aesthetics like resizable widgets. The android experience isn't waiting for your carrier to update your phone when folks with nexus devices are getting updates a couple of days after the update is announced. S3 might be getting updates but I doubt US owners will see one this year. Why can't we get iPhone-esque build quality of the One X with regular up…

How do you think Google should do what you are asking it to do? Remember Microsoft is trying and going nowhere - their upgrades are still a fiasco - despite having a limited set of devices. It is simply not possible for Google to update those hundreds of SKUs out there to the latest version, all at once. The only way they could do that is by limiting hardware choices. People don't seem to like that.

There are rumors that Google will have as many as 5 manufacturers build a Nexus line that they will sell like they do the Galaxy Nexus today. May be that's as close as we will ever get to regular updates for a variety of hardware.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#35

Post by mirkules »

tensafefrogs wrote: post #27

Google doesn't care if android is a "second-rate" OS. Google makes money from people using google. More smart phones = good for google, regardless of the OS the phone runs. Android has been hugely successful in getting phone carriers away from their antiquated systems (remember life before the iPhone?). Yes, the iPhone is massively successful, but there's billions of people in the world who will never own one, and th…

Yes! People often lose sight of what is Google's goal compared to what is Apple's goal. The bulk of Apple's profit is in iDevices (hardware) and services (iTunes, AppStore, etc).

Google's core business is ads. They sell ads by getting as many people to use their services as possible. More devices running any Android directly translates into more money from ads, and I think this article entirely misses this point.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#36

Post by twism »

radley wrote: post #31
twism wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just marketing. IMO, the GSIII is not a bad device, but pure nexus with Jelly Bean from google (hspda+ version, not the verzion nexus which should not be called a nexus device) is the best android (or any mobile OS) experience.

That's just opinion. I have 2 stock JB Nexus devices and yetprefer to use my GS3. If the sims were the same size I would use both since JB has the better voice stuff right now. My point is numbers don't lie. The author laments the GS3 as second rate yet it's clearly the most in-demand device. The author is either deluded, had writers block (and dredged up an old premise), or hoped this might be a popular new link-bai…

Just saying, those numbers are driven by marketing, and the s3 is a newer device with better tech specs, plus the fact you can't get a JB device from any cellphone carrier.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#37

Post by programminggeek »

Android was designed, I believe I read somewhere, to be the most carrier and OEM friendly OS possible for smartphones. It was meant to be skinned, loaded up with software by OEM's ad carriers, but still to act as a kind of compatibility layer between devices.

That alone solves the dev problem with Java ME that you would potentially need to do hundreds of separate builds for different devices and so on. With Android you have one version for all devices.

From that perspective, Android has gone beyond Google's wildest expectations and it solved at a basic level many of the Java ME problems, but that's not even close to the same goal that Apple had when they made the iPhone.

Why are people surprised that a system that was designed from day one to be what it is today isn't the same as iOS?

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#38

Post by twism »

blinkingled wrote: post #34
twism wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android isn't just about apps. From utilities like Google Now, to aesthetics like resizable widgets. The android experience isn't waiting for your carrier to update your phone when folks with nexus devices are getting updates a couple of days after the update is announced. S3 might be getting updates but I doubt US owners will see one this year. Why can't we get iPhone-esque build quality of the One X with regular up…

How do you think Google should do what you are asking it to do? Remember Microsoft is trying and going nowhere - their upgrades are still a fiasco - despite having a limited set of devices. It is simply not possible for Google to update those hundreds of SKUs out there to the latest version, all at once. The only way they could do that is by limiting hardware choices. People don't seem to like that. There are rumors…

I like the avenue that Google is taking. Hopefully the hardware they use for their nexus devices is on par with their flagship heavily customized handsets so not to stifle competition between their devices.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#39

Post by talmand »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #14
talmand wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the very thing that people who should know better keep forgetting or are ignoring, the market doesn't care! Find any random person that has a phone running Android v2.3 and ask them if it bothers them that their phone, which works perfectly fine every day for their needs, is not running the latest and greatest version of Android. I'm willing to bet most of them would not know what you're talking about and…

I agree that the average customer doesn't care but "Why can't people just be happy with the amazing things we have?" is a terrifically awful outlook. If people thought that way, we'd still be using Motorola RAZRs. The flip-style one, not the smartphone one.

I disagree, technology tends to move forwards regardless of the market's feelings towards it. Granted a great deal of technology is driven by the needs of the market but to say we would stagnate on one phone for a long period of time just doesn't work for me.

Re: Saving Android From a Second-Rate Future

#40

Post by talmand »

protomyth wrote: post #18
talmand wrote: post #9

I don't get it, is he complaining about the Android OS or the UI skins that manufacturers choose to install on their devices? Does this mean that if I apply a custom theme to my Windows7 install it is no longer "true" Windows7? Older phones not getting Jelly Bean is a silly complaint at this point, can't we get past this? I just really don't get these type of articles, I can only assume they are link bait since they…

"Older phones not getting Jelly Bean is a silly complaint at this point, can't we get past this?" I would imagine we can get it past it when every phone capable of running the newest Android version is allowed to upgrade to the newest Android version. Until then, it is an issue for developers who want to use the latest APIs.

I can't necessarily disagree, when it comes to developers. Just curious, what are these latest and greatest APIs that's preventing developers from producing quality apps because they don't exist on older phones? Is it because of security and/or functional updates to the OS or is it truly app APIs that some apps just can't exist without?
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