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AppLovin nonconsensual installs

benedelman.org

31–40 of 64 posts

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#31

How does the platform even allow a single tap on an ad to install an app? Edit: Discussed somewhat here https://www.benedelman.org/applovin-permissions/ . Seems like it's abetted by garbage from the carrier. Something for iOS to look forward to?

Ben Edelman here, author of the page you linked above and the full article at https://www.benedelman.org/applovin-nonconsensual-installs/ (linked from top of this page). Happy to answer any questions.

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#32

AppLovin has been doing this for a long time. BlueStacks and some other vendors have been doing this for literally a decade. The root problem is that Google Play is poorly curated. One problem it has is that it ranks apps that have many downloads higher than those with fewer downloads. AppLovin is used to boost downloads for the purposes of the Google Play algorithm. Of course, this is known to Google.

Are you sure BlueStacks installs apps without user consent? I know BlueStacks as an emulator to play Android games on PC and Mac. That's a legitimate business, 100% consistent with what users want. Versus what I (author of the piece linked above) reported is that AppLovin is installing apps that users don't want -- installing silently, installing when users tap X, installing after a quick (5 second) countdown.

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#33

AppLovin makes a gargantuan profit margin of 45%: https://valustox.com/APP Even so, I avoid stocks that don't have a sustainable, value-based business model.

> AppLovin makes a gargantuan profit margin of 45%

65% (68^%) net (gross) income margin for Q2 '25 [1]. 44% (54%) net (gross) for Q2 '24.

(Nitpick: I don't love financial dashboards that don't define and date their metrics. For example, what does leverage on that page mean?)

[1] https://www.sec.gov/ix?doc=/Archives/edgar/data/1751008/0001...

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not even a hundred dollars for the 2020 SE model which still has 2 years of updates in it. For the newer 2022 model it's under 200 from refurb sellers. You can get 13s for under 250. You can even get apple care with the new subscription model and sneak a new battery for 12 bucks. Arguing with bogus facts is bad manner.

You're awfully cavalier with other people's money. Some would call that "bad manners" too since you brought it up. Buying a $100 phone every other year when offered an android phone for free from the carrier is a meaningfully bad financial decision for people less well off than yourself. You are fortunate to be in a position to not have to worry about money like that, but try to have compassion for people less rich t…

Oh stop the wiggling. You said hundreds of dollars and they aren't. Now you are switching your argument to "free phones" there are no free phones you still pay for them. In lower income countries your carrier even installs malware as part of their bloat itself. The backmarket prizes in these countries are even more attainable for older iPhone models. Instead of paying your shady carrier you can finance the refurbs. Just stop making shit up and the petty emotional misdirection when you are called out. Judging from your other comments in themis thread it's your go to discussion instrument...

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're awfully cavalier with other people's money. Some would call that "bad manners" too since you brought it up. Buying a $100 phone every other year when offered an android phone for free from the carrier is a meaningfully bad financial decision for people less well off than yourself. You are fortunate to be in a position to not have to worry about money like that, but try to have compassion for people less rich t…

Oh stop the wiggling. You said hundreds of dollars and they aren't. Now you are switching your argument to "free phones" there are no free phones you still pay for them. In lower income countries your carrier even installs malware as part of their bloat itself. The backmarket prizes in these countries are even more attainable for older iPhone models. Instead of paying your shady carrier you can finance the refurbs. J…

You're making an impressively bad faith argument here.

Yes if you buy an ancient device it is less. If we compare apples to apples, or apples to androids, you could buy an equally old android device for next to nothing. Any "wiggling" was because the discussion was about new devices before you decided to pretend to miss the context clues.

You are delusional if you think that there exists an iPhone that is not much more expensive than a lower end Android of a similar age. All the namecalling and pretending in the world won't make it otherwise.

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#37
I looked through the AppHub APK last year after a friend told me they'd found unknown apps installed on their flagship Samsung, and I was very surprised to find some of the same "direct download" references you did.

I've known for a long time that T-Mobile shipped junk apps upon initial setup, but seeing them loaded OTA after a single click on an ad (even a few pixels off of the "x" button) is very concerning. Even putting aside the moral issues with practices like this, that's a huge security hole in a very large percentage of Android phones.

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#38
post #2

Are there any apps designed to specifically gate every install, including background OTA installs sent by carriers, because I'm security conscious with my devices but I have family who very much are not. Ideally, I can just nag my non-tech savvy relatives to let me install such a security app for them and then enjoy having peace of mind for their behalf.

Yes: “App Store” on iOS protects you against exactly this.

The same "walled garden" app store that is much maligned on HN?

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not saying that you should cajole them into doing something they don’t want to do, but in case it’s useful to anyone else reading this, I had a good experience having family make that switch for that reason. Having used Google, Samsung, and Apple phones extensively, I knew that switching to iOS is way less frustrating than going in the other direction, or even from vanilla Android to Samsung, IMO. The iPhone 16e…

$599 for a phone is frankly exorbitant for what is required here. The phone they have have that was being asked about is probably either free or close to it with carrier incentives. Here on HN we are in a bit of a bubble. Most users of this site can just make a $500 purchase if they want to and not think about it. The median American's liquid savings are well under $10k, and buying the least expensive iPhone is a bur…

And you can get iPhone 14s for $99 on occasion as long as you commit to prepaid service from Total Wireless/Trac Fone for 3 months (so about $180 - so your total price for the phone and 3 months of service is about $300) or you can use carrier trade-in deals to get hundreds of dollars off an iPhone 17, as long as you stay on a postpaid plan and take the credit over 3 years.

Yes, there are way more options to get sub $500 Android phones, but pretending like an iPhone is too expensive for most Americans when carrier deals are often as good or better for iPhone options (to say nothing of the older phones being sold by Total Wireless and the like) and when more people in the United States use iPhone vs Android is a little bit silly.

We just got $1130 from Verizon for my husband's old iPhone 14 Plus towards his new iPhone 17 Pro (I get a new phone every year so I’m just on the Apple Upgrade plan or I buy it outright each year, whereas he gets a new phone every 3 years or so), making it essentially free (we had to change the plan he was on but it cost the same as the old plan) and if he’d wanted a regular iPhone 17, he could’ve dropped down to a cheaper phone plan too. A 16e would’ve been even less than that.

Re: AppLovin nonconsensual installs

#40
post #37

I looked through the AppHub APK last year after a friend told me they'd found unknown apps installed on their flagship Samsung, and I was very surprised to find some of the same "direct download" references you did. I've known for a long time that T-Mobile shipped junk apps upon initial setup, but seeing them loaded OTA after a single click on an ad (even a few pixels off of the "x" button) is very concerning. Even p…

lukec11, I would enjoy chatting with you about methods and findings. Send a note? https://www.benedelman.org/mail/
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