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US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

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Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#31
post #7
post #2

This whole economy by corruption and coercion is not going to work out.

It has historically worked pretty well, for several centuries at a time. Are you saying there’s something different this time ?

Something working well* (at least for well-connected people, relative to the general populace) when world GDP was two orders of magnitude lower does not mean it works well (for the general populace) today.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#32
Tariffs kinda make sense when you have a deficit in a widely available item. Big trade deficit with Bangladesh? Sure you can buy cheap textiles from Thailand or Vietnam or something.

Unfortunately this approach does not work when you lack a viable domestic alternative and you're up against a monopoly.

What will the US do if TSMC does not blink? Not buy TSMC made chips? Obviously that is impossible, so the logical conclusion is that American consumers will end up paying the tariffs.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#34
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will not work out over the long run. This is corruption; it breeds corruption, and corruption creates victims. Victims don't put up with it forever and as the old cold case appeal spiel goes, "alliances shift over time". More prosaically, in the short term: TSMC are now effectively compelled to acquire Intel entirely or at least a controlling share, right? Unless Trump's shakedown requires them to own 49% but then…

TSMC is not going to get over the 50% threshold because it has no free will in this whole matter, as the very existence of Taiwan, and hence of TSMC, depends on the political will of the US. Otherwise I fully agree with you, this will definitely not work out in the long run, but who cares about the long run anymore in this day and age?

But they have to try, right? Otherwise as you say, they are essentially operating under Rubio and Trump's control as a tool of the State Department.

The other important thing about this is that it dirties Intel almost immediately with presidential cheeto dust. So the value is going to fall over the long term, and this isn't the last sell-off they will have to do. Can you stop TSMC or a stalking horse for TSMC buying up parts of the rest?

Trump has created a powerful victim here.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#35

Taiwan is under a tremendous pull by China, both non violent and violent. Any push by the US is a push towards China. Trump has no idea what he is doing. HE can not replace Brazilian coffee, but at least it is "only" coffee. Not being able to replace a fab is a precarious situation. Is he imagining invading Taiwan? China would consider that an invasion to its territory.

I don't think Trump cares if it "works" economically long term. He cares about what he can extract personally and what he got upset about on twitter when he woke up. That's it ...

He was quoted regarding environmental concerns something to the effect of "I'll be dead by then".

I think that's really his POV. If you plan to live longer than Trump, he's really not for you.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#36
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how it can't work at least short term, when the US is by a long margin the world leading military and economic power. Why else has the US been overspending on military for decades and planting military bases and nuclear submarines all over the world, to become the world hegemony, if not to bully everyone in doing its bidding when push comes to shove? I'm not defending the actions of the US, I'm just askin…

When all your military spending can't help you win against a third-world country (USA in Afghanistan) or a single country 1/3 your size (Russia in Ukraine), it really makes you wonder if all that spending is justified to uphold one big bluff.

Winning is different from taking over.. Russia wants to rule over Ukraine, not destroy it.

US was all into destroying Afghanistan and Iraq. They had no intention of being there long term.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#40
post #12
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has historically worked pretty well, for several centuries at a time. Are you saying there’s something different this time ?

I don't know what you're thinking of.

Well, I am British and have studied a tiny bit of my own country's history... so I do.

But consider who in the world really loves the British. You don't need much time to make a list. Or even a paper and pen.

The main difference between the British Empire and the American Empire is that the American Empire is being led by a man who believes tariffs are a tax on foreign countries and retail prices can be cut by more than 100% and remain positive.

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