Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools • Hacker News Board

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#31

Post by api » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:07 PM UTC

ascondabout wrote: post #18

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

I’ll explain it clearly: it is impossible to accommodate someone who wants you dead.

It doesn't seem to stop people from having sympathy for the victims of collective punishment, like Palestinian Muslims whose social views tend toward the extreme right, in other countries.

It's hard, I agree. When someone hates you it's by far the easiest path to hate them back. But that's not going to change anyone's mind. It will make them double down.

Edit: I'm not bashing Queers for Palestine. It's brilliant. It's probably changed some peoples' minds in that region of the world. You don't hear about it, of course, because when people reconsider long-held and culturally dominant beliefs they often don't say anything about it for a long time. They reconsider quietly. Bigots and hate-mongers and war-mongers are loud.

One big rule for interpreting culture is: the craziest, meanest, most bigoted people are almost always the loudest. The wise whisper and the idiot yells.

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#32

Post by jobs_throwaway » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:07 PM UTC

BIG caveat that these scores are adjusted for gender, age, and race or ethnicity, free and reduced-price lunch receipt status, special education status, and English language learner status. In terms of raw scores, Mississippi is still in the bottom 10.

Not really that impressive IMO.

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#33

Post by hooverd » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:07 PM UTC

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

As someone who grew up in "rural American white culture, Christian conservative culture", you can't get away with saying half the shit they say about cities and urban areas about them. We propose solutions but those solutions are economic, not a return to default status for them. I've seen the vile, disgusting things rural people say about minorities and LGBT because outwardly I'm just another white dude. I've had grandmas scream at me about Obama being the devil (because I thought canvassing in '08 was a good idea).

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#34

Post by OhMeadhbh » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

So... uh... this seems to say "if you eliminate all the test scores that are bad, Mississippi only has good test scores left." By "adjusting" student test scores based on age, gender, ethnicity and whether or not they get a school lunch, what they're really saying is "there are a lot of poor kids who qualify for school lunches" rather than "there are a lot of poor kids who did remarkably well on standardized tests."

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#35

Post by throwanem » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

yogurt-male wrote: post #20

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

I think the reason the left trashes this segment of the country is for two reasons. First, I don't think they're fully aware of how different the circumstances are for a middle-class (sub)urban person and a poor rural one. I doubt many "coastal elites" have spent much time in rural Alabama, for example. Second, they're able to extend empathy to the ignorant poor in other countries because they don't have to suffer th…

Spoken like a rich white liberal. I grew up in Mississippi white and poor, and I had friends (when we could get away with that) who were black and poor.

If you haven't noticed the way those latter are kept apart - quite literally the oldest play in America - then you haven't been nearly as attentive as you imagine yourself to be. The ignorant contempt you display here confirms it. Well, as you correctly note, ignorance in some cases is a choice. Choose better.

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#36

Post by kardianos » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

kogus wrote: post #3

This was very interesting to read, and news to me. It's gratifying to see Mississippi prove that it's possible to break out of a pattern of failure. I would love to see a discussion around the specific policies and practices that MS has put in place to actually achieve these results. The article doesn't really discuss that.

They teach using proven methods, like phonics. They actually teach math. They test and use that as real information. They focus on results not on ideology.

They do NOT encurage using Paulo Freire's "methods".

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#37

Post by seabird » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

They absolutely should be doing this but they're never going to. For a huge number of people, this is Team Blue vs Team Red. Those born-drunk fuckup hick racists are Team Red so their role in the game is to be a verbal punching bag.

There's a very real chance that the Democrat demographic coalition collapses in our lifetime. The contempt so many commentators held for groups that "surprisingly" swung for Trump is pretty telling of how this is probably going to keep going.

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#38

Post by scarmig » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

Identity politics of all sorts get their salience by having enemies to coalesce around. Who would be the enemy of your broadened woke coalition? White coastal elites?

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#39

Post by germinalphrase » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

api wrote: post #4

"Painting the Deep South as an embarrassing cultural backwater is one of the last socially acceptable forms of prejudice among elites. It’s not just tolerated - it’s venerated." Warning: possible flame bait, though I do not intend it this way. I am serious. I've had this thought for quite a while: the (social) left could pivot and win by being more woke. WTF? What I mean by this is: expand diversity and inclusion to…

If the social policy of the progressive left were capable of wrapping itself in the messaging of Family, Community, and Freedom for rural America - there would be an appetite. Remember that for a large swath of Trump voters, Bernie Sanders was their second choice candidate.

Re: Mississippi Can't Possibly Have Good Schools

#40

Post by WaitWaitWha » Wed, May 07, 2025, 2:08 PM UTC

duxup wrote: post #2

I wish this story dove into the "why" or what these test results even are / validate them rather than finger wag at everyone within shouting distance.

I think it is sprinkled throughout the article:

e.g., the section "Edu-Snobbery Hurts Us All", "Mississippi, Louisiana and Alabama climbed the charts because they focused on core academic instruction when much of the country used ESSA as an excuse to focus on anything and everything else. It paid off."