Principles for Building One-Shot AI Agents • Hacker News Board

Re: Principles for Building One-Shot AI Agents

#31

Post by randysalami » Sun, Apr 20, 2025, 7:41 PM UTC

devmor wrote: post #28

randysalami wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you’re right that they can’t “solve” the halting problem but are more capable at dealing with it than classic ai agents and more physically grounded. Outside monitoring would be required but I’d imagine less so than classical systems and in physically different ways; and to be fair, humans require monitoring too if they should halt or not, haha.

Can you explain why you think this? I’m curious. Humans don’t encounter an infinite loop problem because we are not “process-bound” - we may spend too long on a task but ultimately we are constantly evaluating whether or not we should continue (even if our priorities may not be the same as whoever assigned us a task). The monitoring is built-in, by nature of our cross-task processing.

100%. We have built-in faculties for stopping and halting. My point wasn’t that humans physically need a monitor to determine when to stop or else suffer an infinite loop; sleep, eating, and death are perfectly effective at that. I was making a bit of a joke in the efficacy of agents being subjective around halting. A classical or quantum agent might go on forever to solve its goal, getting stuck and needing an outside monitor to reset or redefine it. Contrast that to a human agent; given a goal, they might never even try to solve it in the first place! Without outside monitors, systems of human agents may not start when needed or halt when optimal yet we’ve kept it going for thousands of years!

Re: Principles for Building One-Shot AI Agents

#32

Post by daxfohl » Mon, Apr 21, 2025, 6:54 PM UTC

randysalami wrote: post #30

daxfohl wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it's definitely not "try every possibility in parallel", as is sometimes portrayed by people who don't know better. While quantum computing makes it possible to superpose multiple possibilities, the way quantum mechanics works, you can only measure one (and you have to decide ahead of time which one to measure, i.e. you can't ask the quantum system like "give me the superposition with the highest value"). That's…

“Nature isn’t classical, dammit, and if you want to make a simulation of nature, you’d better make it quantum mechanical, and by golly it’s a wonderful problem, because it doesn’t look so easy” (Richard Feynman). Quantum systems are physical systems, classical systems due to their very nature only can emulate it. When it comes to agents like we were discussing before, a classical agent will always be limited by the a…

This is irrelevant. First, quantum programs don't "get" anything just by virtue of being quantum code, any more than classical computers "get" the foundations of electricity and magnetism because they use electrons. Second, classical computers absolutely can simulate quantum systems. They're inefficient, but they can do it. Third, determining whether an agent is stuck in an infinite loop has nothing to do with the physical world. They're just binary code running on a Turing machine. Fourth, the halting problem is provably unsolvable in both classical and quantum systems, so there's not even a relationship here. Fifth, what do you mean by quantum systems are physical? Does this mean classical systems aren't? Are physical systems only those that use every aspect of physics? Then quantum systems aren't physical either because they can't account for gravity. So do we need quantum gravitational computers? Sixth, what does "getting" quantum mechanics that have to do with AI agents? Do I need to understand quantum physics before I can have a conversation with someone? Can I not read an email without an appeal to hilbert space? Just, none of this is related to quantum computing. It's like having a bug in a deployment and saying string theory would've prevented that.

Re: Principles for Building One-Shot AI Agents

#33

Post by daxfohl » Mon, Apr 21, 2025, 9:35 PM UTC

daxfohl wrote: post #32

randysalami wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Nature isn’t classical, dammit, and if you want to make a simulation of nature, you’d better make it quantum mechanical, and by golly it’s a wonderful problem, because it doesn’t look so easy” (Richard Feynman). Quantum systems are physical systems, classical systems due to their very nature only can emulate it. When it comes to agents like we were discussing before, a classical agent will always be limited by the a…

This is irrelevant. First, quantum programs don't "get" anything just by virtue of being quantum code, any more than classical computers "get" the foundations of electricity and magnetism because they use electrons. Second, classical computers absolutely can simulate quantum systems. They're inefficient, but they can do it. Third, determining whether an agent is stuck in an infinite loop has nothing to do with the ph…

I see intermixing of the terms quantum computer and quantum system. These are different concepts, and I think that's the source of the confusion. A quantum computer is a well defined thing. It's just like a classical computer but instead of just binary bits, it can work with qubits that support superposition. But it still needs programs just like a classical computer, and the results that we can actually read are binary in both cases.

Both of them are quantum "systems", in that both require quantum physics to work, if we're considering modern CPU gate sizes. Just, classical computers expose binary bits, and quantum computers expose qubits.

What I think you're picturing is a quantum "system", like a blob of quantum goo, that you can toss some "state" into and...something. But, that's not what a quantum computer is, any more than a classical computer is something you could throw into a blob of electrical goop and expect it to do anything.