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Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

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Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#31

Post by duffmancd »

technion wrote: post #28
pkdpic wrote: post #18

> the recurse center social rules foster collaboration and psychological safety, consider using them > No well-actually’s > No feigned surprise > No backseat driving > No subtle -isms There seems to be something really magical about the Recurse Center social rules. Or maybe their admissions process. Or both. I did a batch a couple years ago and I was stunned at how fun and drama-free people are there. I've heard occa…

How can this work in practice? "The sky is green". How do you answer this without breaking the first rule?

> A well-actually is when you correct someone about something that’s not relevant to the conversation or tangential to what they’re trying to say.

So, as long as the conversation is about the colour of the sky, (or about green things) you can just answer it.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#32

Post by renewiltord »

isoprophlex wrote: post #29
pkdpic wrote: post #18

> the recurse center social rules foster collaboration and psychological safety, consider using them > No well-actually’s > No feigned surprise > No backseat driving > No subtle -isms There seems to be something really magical about the Recurse Center social rules. Or maybe their admissions process. Or both. I did a batch a couple years ago and I was stunned at how fun and drama-free people are there. I've heard occa…

How do they make that work, you think? Could you say a bit more? One weirdo can severely mess up group dynamics, which is deadly for a small nascent club-type thing. What if you have someone join who's ferociously intelligent, and not outright evil but just inherently socially maladjusted? You just kick em out if they can't help themselves to continuous "well actually"s, even though they mean well? That in itself mig…

Overall, not arguing over the minutia of the rules probably is the best way to do this. I liked the way ggerganov just ended the anti-jt PR drama that started on llama.cpp by banning both participants. Sometimes if you just stop things, they go somewhere else and that's life.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#33

Post by Larrikin »

pkdpic wrote: post #18

> the recurse center social rules foster collaboration and psychological safety, consider using them > No well-actually’s > No feigned surprise > No backseat driving > No subtle -isms There seems to be something really magical about the Recurse Center social rules. Or maybe their admissions process. Or both. I did a batch a couple years ago and I was stunned at how fun and drama-free people are there. I've heard occa…

Reading the list for the first time its amazing how well it captures some of the worst parts of "nerd" culture. Interacting with kids and public school will help you navigate regular jerks, but it was always frustrating joining an anime club, programming club, etc and finding these exact people in there, but being unsure why these normally quiet people are actually just as awful and instantly regretting even making the effort.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#34

Post by MrVandemar »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #14
t_mann wrote: post #11

> meetups about "how to node.js apolitically" are sidelining people who want "how to node.js pro-socially." This statement did turn me off a bit. "how to node.js apolitically" would in practice ofc just be "how to node.js", which should be perfectly fine for a computer club, just as a pro-social computing course. Maybe someone wants to use their computing skills for social good, maybe they want to use them for biosci…

For me it was the part where the author claims that "computing is political", therefore computer clubs should be too. Computing is very much not political. It's a tool. Like any tool, it can be used for various ends, both political and apolitical. If you want a computer club, have a computer club. If you want a political club, have a political club. But I think forcing the two together weakens both pursuits.

A firearm is a tool.

Do you think firearm ownership and usage is free from politics? Do you think a gun club is free from politics?

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#37

Post by isoprophlex »

renewiltord wrote: post #32
isoprophlex wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do they make that work, you think? Could you say a bit more? One weirdo can severely mess up group dynamics, which is deadly for a small nascent club-type thing. What if you have someone join who's ferociously intelligent, and not outright evil but just inherently socially maladjusted? You just kick em out if they can't help themselves to continuous "well actually"s, even though they mean well? That in itself mig…

Overall, not arguing over the minutia of the rules probably is the best way to do this. I liked the way ggerganov just ended the anti-jt PR drama that started on llama.cpp by banning both participants. Sometimes if you just stop things, they go somewhere else and that's life.

Basically, I take that as a simple mix of "don't feed the trolls" and "we don't behave like that here". Sounds pretty pragmatic and enforceable, in fact. Thanks.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#38

Post by hiAndrewQuinn »

>computing is political, so let computer club be political too

I agree but probably not in the way the author intended. To build a working, affordable, modern computer requires handling the most complicated mass consumer supply chain the world has yet seen - and that's before you get into any software you want to run atop it. The fact that such machines can be had new for less than the price of a used car is nothing short of a capitalist miracle.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#39

Post by pastage »

onionisafruit wrote: post #27
plantwallshoe wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think computer is political in the way art is inherently political. Even if a piece of art isn’t explicitly about politics (an oil painting of a sunset), it’s still born of the lived experience and thoughts and emotions and politics of the artist.

so not political

Having been part running of three +1000 members computer clubs with a weekly attendance of about 10-150. I would rather say that if you are not political you do not have a club.

One of the standard by laws for clubs here is "not bound to political party", i.e we had a few extreme right wing people and many left wing and a great mass of moderate.

GNU GPL is political, every choice you do in computers have a political component. You choose if you allow piracy, black hats, surveillance, alcohol, meat, veganism etc. These are political decisions that will effect the feel of your club, even if you actively do not care about a decision.

The important part is that the club needs to survive and it only does that if you manage to find new people who wants do stuff, and put partisanship aside.

Re: Start a computer club in the place that you live (2023)

#40

Post by pastage »

easterncalculus wrote: post #12
t_mann wrote: post #11

> meetups about "how to node.js apolitically" are sidelining people who want "how to node.js pro-socially." This statement did turn me off a bit. "how to node.js apolitically" would in practice ofc just be "how to node.js", which should be perfectly fine for a computer club, just as a pro-social computing course. Maybe someone wants to use their computing skills for social good, maybe they want to use them for biosci…

Rent alone is expensive enough, having rules that micromanage the many ways people have reasonable conversation and give basic presentations is only going to get your space killed from people wanting to stir up drama. There are enough real problems running these, there's no point in creating more of them.

This has not been a problem in my many years of club meetings. There will always be drama not this though. Never micromanaged behaviour though, but that is a very undefined term.
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