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Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

geocod.io

31–40 of 47 posts

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#31
post #23
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d love to hear more about the idea that somebody making a fraudulent signup with a stolen credit card is potentially going to pay full price if they “get caught”

There are obviously people who are doing free trial abuse for commercial gain eg. Signing up 1k accounts to get test credit cards or to resell accounts. They are not going to convert (although sometimes you can successfully convert them into affiliates) We have seen individuals just trying to get free accounts week after week, who when nudged once pay immediately thousands of dollars even after using fake, stolen or…

> We have seen individuals just trying to get free accounts week after week, who when nudged once pay immediately

This pattern is everywhere. It was foreign to me for a long time because I'm the type of person who likes to play within the rules. There are a lot of people who get a kick out of gaming the system to their advantage, even to the point of breaking the law.

Many people have zero qualms about stealing things when they imagine it's a faceless corporation on the other side. They might even rationalize it with mental gymnastics until they think they're doing the right thing. You see it most often when the topic of media piracy or sharing Netflix logins comes up.

This mindset is very common in startup communities. I've heard so many stories from founders gloating about how they abused some system or used a loophole to avoid paying for something they could clearly afford. It's like a badge of honor to some people. I know one guy who bought an EV but hasn't installed a charger because he drives it to a business down the street and uses the EV charger they installed for their employees every night. Another guy used to brag about sneaking into a cafeteria for another organization and stealing lunch every day. A while ago I talked to a guy who liked to "dine and dash" without paying his tab, even though he could easily afford it. For them, it's all about getting away with it and winning a game.

As soon as you make it obvious that someone is watching them, they cave. They don't want to be the type of person who abuses actual people. They only like to abuse what they see as faceless systems.

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#32

How does an address API get it's info? Presumably addresses don't change often right? When they do, how does a service like this update it's records?

Actually, I found this very same company has a previous blog post addressing this question: https://www.geocod.io/code-and-coordinates/2025-01-13-how-ge...

This is cool! They mention they aggregate from over 3000 sources. What are the usual sources for something like this? Is this public government data from cities?

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#34

When sites use an AI generated image like this and don't bother to spend 10 seconds looking to make sure it looks okay (UIGN SIGN UPP? AISK ANACIS?) it makes me question whether that same level of care was put into writing the article.

Isn't it nice to have just a little bit of an illustration instead of just text? Obviously an AI-generated image is going to spit out some nonsense text as part of the graphic, but we're not really trying to hide that it's AI generated.

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#35
post #22

Apple‘s mail privacy protection creates disposable addresses with host icloud.com. It’s not as hassle free and can’t be automated, but this could definitely be used to create a lot of free accounts. But I don’t see them banning this domain I guess?

We are mainly B2B so we don't really see signups using Apple's email relay. That said, it could be something we might have to consider blocking in the future if it becomes a problem.

For paying customers, it probably doesn't make a lot of sense to use an anonymous email address, since we ask for your name and billing address either way (have to stay compliant with sales taxes!)

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#36

very cool, I wasn't expecting to find this so interesting. I yesterday for the first time thought about the "abuse the free tier" actors. I was trying to use a batching job service which limited free-tier batch sizes to 5, which was so low that it took away the point from using the automated job in the first place. I think the little info box explained that they keep the limit low to prevent abuse, and I started thin…

Thanks for giving it a read!

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#37
post #12

Where can we get a blocklist of those throwaway email domains? or perhaps a really big whitelist of good ones? that would be extremely helpful!

There's a couple of great open source projects[1][2][3] that try to keep up-to-date lists of domains that belong to disposable email providers.

I would probably not recommend implementing a whitelist for blocking purposes. But perhaps domains on a whitelist could get a slight scoring bump.

[1] https://github.com/disposable-email-domains/disposable-email... [2] https://github.com/disposable/disposable [3] https://github.com/unkn0w/disposable-email-domain-list

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#38

When sites use an AI generated image like this and don't bother to spend 10 seconds looking to make sure it looks okay (UIGN SIGN UPP? AISK ANACIS?) it makes me question whether that same level of care was put into writing the article.

Isn't it nice to have just a little bit of an illustration instead of just text? Obviously an AI-generated image is going to spit out some nonsense text as part of the graphic, but we're not really trying to hide that it's AI generated.

I think things that require high credibility and have a learned readerbase it'd be better to not give a careless image, even at the cost of a cool image. I wouldn't mind an almost right image on some advert for cleanex or intranet holiday reminder mail, but I would be very concerned if it was used as part of EU directive

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#39

Thanks for this writeup. Whenever people complain about some service removing or making it harder to try out a free tier, I think they don't realize the amount of abuse that needs to be managed by the service providers. "Why do things suck?" Because parasites ruined it for the rest of us. > We have to accept a certain amount of abuse. It is a far better use of our time to use it improving Geocodio for legitimate user…

Co-Founder of Geocodio here who designed the scoring system :)

I suppose you could call it inspired by Bayesian inference since we're using multiple pieces of independent evidence to calculate a score, though that makes it sound a bit fancier than it is and we aren't using the Bayes' theorem. But it's possible I had that in the back of my head from a game theory class I took long ago.

But for the fun of it, let's model it that way:

Probability (Spam | disposable email domain, IP address, etc... ) = [probability(disposable email domain, IP address, etc... | spam) x prior probability(spam rate)] / probability(disposable email domain, IP address, etc...)

Or something like that.

Also — it's a delight to have one of Patrick's articles mentioned in connection with this!

Re: Keeping our free tier sustainable by preventing abuse

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, I found this very same company has a previous blog post addressing this question: https://www.geocod.io/code-and-coordinates/2025-01-13-how-ge...

This is cool! They mention they aggregate from over 3000 sources. What are the usual sources for something like this? Is this public government data from cities?

yep! Local governments create some of the source data we use for tax purposes.

We have more about our data sources here: https://www.geocod.io/data-sources/

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