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Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

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Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#31

Post by joe_the_user »

DiscourseFan wrote: post #3

This is such a mess. How can I both endorse a politicians approach to the world and disagree with every particular action? Trump is right about government overspending, unaccountability, the need to reign in the bureaucratic class. But he is doing it in the absolute worst way possible. Cuts to Public Health? with H5N1 coming looming over us? It won't be China coming to power in 10 years, it'll happen in two when they…

The thing I'd offer that you could perhaps consider that the people who push the "starve the beast" rhetoric are generally not in favor of accountability or efficiency but simply grifters leveraging people's shallow understanding of how government works - and that's the earlier cycles, not just the current obvious one.

The thing is that the ordinary cycle of government balances political interests with the need to actually accomplish things in an imperfect fashion. Whereas "broad cuts" tend to allow only the politically connected to survive since cuts have no rationality beyond "this government makes no sense".

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#32

Post by WillPostForFood »

jfengel wrote: post #22
DiscourseFan wrote: post #3

This is such a mess. How can I both endorse a politicians approach to the world and disagree with every particular action? Trump is right about government overspending, unaccountability, the need to reign in the bureaucratic class. But he is doing it in the absolute worst way possible. Cuts to Public Health? with H5N1 coming looming over us? It won't be China coming to power in 10 years, it'll happen in two when they…

Here's the thing: you and he are also wrong about the overspending, unaccountability, and the bureaucratic class. Those things exist in about the same proportion they exist in any other large corporation, and is not special to the government. There has been a decades long campaign of Just Plain Lies to tell you otherwise. He is failing to seek out the waste, fraud, and abuse because they do not exist in anywhere near…

you and he are also wrong about the overspending, unaccountability, and the bureaucratic class.

I see spending at 123% of GDP, never that high outside war.

I see $35.46 trillion in debt, tripled over the last 20 years.

I dunno, looks he is right about overspending.

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#33

Post by JohnTHaller »

nextos wrote: post #24
e40 wrote: post #4

As other nations ramp up their scientific knowledge we are ramping it down.

I wonder if this will have a similar effect to Brexit. When the Brexit referendum outcome was Leave, I was in Cambridge. The head of one of the largest departments at the university told me the week following the result most applicants who had recently accepted tenure-track offers changed their minds and declined. Several prominent faculty members also began making plans to move to the EU. Over time, however, these e…

I have two friends in Europe now who were going to send their kids to American universities in the next couple years. Both decided not to based on current events.

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#34

Post by DiscourseFan »

smw wrote: post #29
DiscourseFan wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the particulars. The general approach is the destruction of the post-war great society new deal agenda that was already on its way out during reagan/thatcher and had only become an increasing weight represented by a bourgeoning managerial class that absorbed almost all economic gains outside of the ultrawealthy. That class, who enforced this chokehold of economic stagnation, needed to be done away with, perhap…

The economic gains are being absorbed by the billionaires who are running the asylum

the billionaires have a lot of money as individual anomalies, but most wealth is generated by corporations that must pay market rates for labor or else they will get undercut by other businesses; labor is never cheap. Thus, those at the upper-echelons of the working-class--managers, senior engineers, etc.--as a class, hold the most significant stores of wealth in the US, perhaps far more than all the billionaires put together. I think about 10% of US workers make between $150-$300k a year, so multiply that number by twenty million--something like 2 trillion dollars just in one class alone. Billionaires cannot possibly account for the vast majority of GDP.

Let's not forget that in the last 10 years the US has added approx 12 trillion dollars to its GDP which far outpaces inflation in that same period, meaning absolute wealth in the US has increased remarkably--and, yes, the majority of that wealth is paid out to workers who make up the largest class in the country.

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#35

Post by dashundchen »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #32
jfengel wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's the thing: you and he are also wrong about the overspending, unaccountability, and the bureaucratic class. Those things exist in about the same proportion they exist in any other large corporation, and is not special to the government. There has been a decades long campaign of Just Plain Lies to tell you otherwise. He is failing to seek out the waste, fraud, and abuse because they do not exist in anywhere near…

you and he are also wrong about the overspending, unaccountability, and the bureaucratic class. I see spending at 123% of GDP, never that high outside war. I see $35.46 trillion in debt, tripled over the last 20 years. I dunno, looks he is right about overspending.

I don't know how many times I need to repeat this.

Musk and Trump are not concerned about debt or spending. If they were, Trump and Republicans wouldn't be rushing a billionaire tax cut bill that will add tens of trillions of dollars to the national debt.

If Trump cared about debt he wouldn't have run up $8 trillion in debt his last term with PPP helicopter money and more billionaire tax cuts.

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#36

Post by eadler »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #30
smt88 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the federal budget the president cannot just cut. He legally can't cut any of it . Not even $1. Congress controls spending. Illegally (which is how he has always operated and is operating now), he can seemingly do whatever he wants.

The courts say it is legal, so as of today, it is legal. Unless a higher court reverses the decision, you can complain about it, but you should complain on truthful grounds. Trump administration can continue mass firings of federal workers, judge rules https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/20/ruling-firin...

The article states that the lawsuit was rejected merely on procedural grounds (specifically the doctrine of administrative exhaustion) . It does not come close to stating that the action was legal.

The actual court decison (which I have also read) is consistent with the article.

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#37

Post by smt88 »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #30
smt88 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the federal budget the president cannot just cut. He legally can't cut any of it . Not even $1. Congress controls spending. Illegally (which is how he has always operated and is operating now), he can seemingly do whatever he wants.

The courts say it is legal, so as of today, it is legal. Unless a higher court reverses the decision, you can complain about it, but you should complain on truthful grounds. Trump administration can continue mass firings of federal workers, judge rules https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/20/ruling-firin...

1. Firing != reducing spending

2. Many of the employment and B2B contracts they're cancelling are breaching the contracts, so much of the firing is likely illegal

3. This judge didn't rule on the legality, meaning his ruling has no bearing on whether it's legal:

"However, Cooper on Thursday said, he likely lacks the power to hear the case, and the unions instead must file complaints with a federal labor board that hears disputes between unions and federal agencies."

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#38

Post by [deleted] »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #30
smt88 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the federal budget the president cannot just cut. He legally can't cut any of it . Not even $1. Congress controls spending. Illegally (which is how he has always operated and is operating now), he can seemingly do whatever he wants.

The courts say it is legal, so as of today, it is legal. Unless a higher court reverses the decision, you can complain about it, but you should complain on truthful grounds. Trump administration can continue mass firings of federal workers, judge rules https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/20/ruling-firin...

[deleted]

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#39

Post by WillPostForFood »

dashundchen wrote: post #35
WillPostForFood wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you and he are also wrong about the overspending, unaccountability, and the bureaucratic class. I see spending at 123% of GDP, never that high outside war. I see $35.46 trillion in debt, tripled over the last 20 years. I dunno, looks he is right about overspending.

I don't know how many times I need to repeat this. Musk and Trump are not concerned about debt or spending. If they were, Trump and Republicans wouldn't be rushing a billionaire tax cut bill that will add tens of trillions of dollars to the national debt. If Trump cared about debt he wouldn't have run up $8 trillion in debt his last term with PPP helicopter money and more billionaire tax cuts.

But you at least acknowledge there is a spending problem?

Re: Ax falls on elite group of PhDs training to lead U.S. public health labs

#40

Post by WillPostForFood »

smt88 wrote: post #37
WillPostForFood wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The courts say it is legal, so as of today, it is legal. Unless a higher court reverses the decision, you can complain about it, but you should complain on truthful grounds. Trump administration can continue mass firings of federal workers, judge rules https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/20/ruling-firin...

1. Firing != reducing spending 2. Many of the employment and B2B contracts they're cancelling are breaching the contracts, so much of the firing is likely illegal 3. This judge didn't rule on the legality, meaning his ruling has no bearing on whether it's legal: "However, Cooper on Thursday said, he likely lacks the power to hear the case, and the unions instead must file complaints with a federal labor board that he…

1. Firing != reducing spending

?

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