> Sharon Zhang is a news writer at Truthout covering politics, climate and labor. In other words, no experience with how corporate taxes work.
Taxes are part of politics
Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
31–40 of 267 posts
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#32I may be wrong, but I understand this is because the company invests all of its income into its business - which means more jobs, work for other companies, and so on. I think it better money goes into the economy, in a reasonably efficient way, rather than being taken by the State, and used in an unreasonably inefficient way.
No. If Tesla (and the other companies mentioned) were investing all of this money into the business, then it would not be showing up as profits. Company taxes are not like individual taxes where only income is considered, and spending (mostly) disregarded.
Depending on which line on the income statement this is about, it is either money that could be sent to shareholders as dividends or buybacks, or money going into the cash reserves of the company.
And you are pushing a lot of opinion on the "unreasonably inefficient way". Governments are often very efficient spenders when you look at outcomes, often making private industries look awful. Medicare is a great example. It has a expense ratio of about %1.3, whereas the estimate for the Medicare Advantage plans (where they get to play games about who they let in) is that most of those private companies have an expense ratio of about %17. Private insurers are generally a bit better, usually at about %8.
To put more of a point on this, in the Affordable Care Act it was felt necessary to put a cap on the expense ratio of private insurers at %20 (%15 for large providers). That right there defines the "unreasonably inefficient way" we should be talking about.
I am not arguing that there is no waste in government, that would be silly. But the notion that government spending is generally a waste is not supported by the facts, and is more of a religious statement.
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#33Why pay taxes when you can just buy the Whitehouse? It's so much cheaper.
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#34You know what’s ironic is that Tesla survived because of Obama era subsidies. They were desperate to get one private enterprise to succeed because so many solar and other “clean” energy private ventures failed during that period. So, in my view, Obama created Elon. Now the rest of America has to deal with it in addition to the abject failure that is PPACA which ballooned US healthcare costs (not that Republicans have…
Dang are we back to the years of the "Thanks Obama" I guess we truly live at the end of history and have no option but to rehash the classics, don't we ?
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#35I may be wrong, but I understand this is because the company invests all of its income into its business - which means more jobs, work for other companies, and so on. I think it better money goes into the economy, in a reasonably efficient way, rather than being taken by the State, and used in an unreasonably inefficient way.
Neoliberalism runs deep with this comment.
This is a neoliberalist forum. All startup ecosystem is a neoliberal concept.
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#36You know what’s ironic is that Tesla survived because of Obama era subsidies. They were desperate to get one private enterprise to succeed because so many solar and other “clean” energy private ventures failed during that period. So, in my view, Obama created Elon. Now the rest of America has to deal with it in addition to the abject failure that is PPACA which ballooned US healthcare costs (not that Republicans have…
Dang are we back to the years of the "Thanks Obama" I guess we truly live at the end of history and have no option but to rehash the classics, don't we ?
Sorry for the political comment but every time I see Tesla financials I think “this company should’ve failed in 2014 but-for those subsidies and ill-conceived carbon credits.”
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
In what world is a massively profitable company paying almost nothing in taxes polarizing?
[flagged]
There were no value judgements in either of my posts. Like the article, you’ve not presented any reasons for your opinion or attitude or derision.
I value reinvestment, but now you’ve insulted a potential ally. What good does this do your cause?
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#38Sounds like this is the result of "accelerated depreciation." As far as I can tell, that's a strategy that ultimately allows you to pay less tax one year and more tax in a later year. I don't have a strong feeling on the value of that particular tax law, but it seems somewhat less nefarious than the implied "not paying taxes at all."
Same amount of money now is worth more than in future
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#39[flagged]
Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income
#40I wish this article was written with a less biased tone. I'm genuinely interested in understanding it better. As far as I can tell, the article cites two things: $500M tax savings by using an accelerated depreciation schedule (unclear if they saved $500M more by using accelerated vs a regular depreciation schedule, but I assume no) and they claimed $300M in tax credits. The article doesn't address the other $1.5B, pr…
[flagged]
It's not rage-bait, it's a practical example of both how bad the tax code is and most topically how abusive Tesla is to the country that "hosts" it.
Also there's really no such thing as fiduciary duty in public companies, not to the degree you're talking about or it's implied actions.
I wish people would stop repeating it in that fashion, it's just a thought-terminating cliche. Violating fiduciary duty would be something like, spending a bunch of the corporations money on an investment you knew was fraudulent because a connection owns the other business/venture. It is NOT "you paid more in taxes than you could have gotten away with" or any other method of profiteering.
TL;DR fiduciary duty =/= maximizing profit