An update on Google's compliance with the DMA • Hacker News Board

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#31

Post by walkingthisquai » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:12 PM UTC

jjulius wrote: post #17

walkingthisquai wrote: post #15

I know everyone loves hating on Google here, but some of the changes that they were required to make are genuinely quite annoying. Maps results on the search page don't work like they used to. Clicking the mini-map doesn't open to Google Maps anymore, so you have to relearn some behaviours. I know it's minor stuff (for now), but as a long time happy user of Maps, this kind of thing does not benefit me, and I don't ge…

1.) Click the mini map when the result comes up. 2.) Click the button in the bottom right of the mini map that says, "Open in Maps". Voila! Literally just one extra click or tap - what's the issue? Is a single extra tap really "genuinely quite annoying"?

Where I am (France) there is no such button in the mini map.

The workaround I found, after at first assuming that the maps integration was broken, is to click the directions button underneath the map. This opens Maps and draws a route from my current location to the address you searched. Which you then have to dismiss and zoom to what you were looking for. So a few clicks + navigation.

It's the principle though. It's making my user experience worse and I think it's fair for Google to point that out.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#32

Post by alde » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:13 PM UTC

Ha, the experiment will run in Germany, Belgium and Estonia. Estonia seems to be added for not making it too obvious they are targeting the decision centers of the EU.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#33

Post by snarbles » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:15 PM UTC

IncreasePosts wrote: post #20

rwmj wrote: post #2

I don't think I've ever read a company whinging so much about having to obey the law. Comes across like a petulant child.

Your unspoken premise is that the law in question is reasonable.

I'll speak it. The law in question is reasonable.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#34

Post by mattlondon » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:15 PM UTC

bbqfog wrote: post #7

bjt wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sincerely asking... help me connect the dots there? Suppose Google is broken up into separate businesses, one for search and one for ads. Is the idea that the search side would have no incentive to show hotel search results on a map? I'm not seeing the connection between the breakup proposal and the features discussed in the post.

No the idea would be that the search would lose its ability to be a monopoly because Chrome + Search + Maps + Android... would stop artificially propping it up in the market. There would be many search engines and the ability for one to drastically impact other industries with UI changes would go away.

But there already are many search engines?

I recently got a couple of new windows laptops and Edge defaulted to Bing, but after changing away from Bing it is relentlessly trying to make me set Bing as the default search engine every few days.

Note that I am using Edge here, not Chrome. Last time I installed Chrome I think it forced me to pick a default search engine, and didn't endlessly harass me to pick Google as its default (I use duck duck go)

I don't see how they could break up Google without forcing MS and Apple to also be broken up too since they're doing the same things with forcing Edge/Bing and Safari on everyone.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#35

Post by bbqfog » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:17 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #34

bbqfog wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No the idea would be that the search would lose its ability to be a monopoly because Chrome + Search + Maps + Android... would stop artificially propping it up in the market. There would be many search engines and the ability for one to drastically impact other industries with UI changes would go away.

But there already are many search engines? I recently got a couple of new windows laptops and Edge defaulted to Bing, but after changing away from Bing it is relentlessly trying to make me set Bing as the default search engine every few days. Note that I am using Edge here, not Chrome. Last time I installed Chrome I think it forced me to pick a default search engine, and didn't endlessly harass me to pick Google as i…

MS has all the same issues as Google, this is why they can release inferior product and have it survive in the market. I also use DuckDuckGo as would many other people if you severed Google Search's monopolistic lifelines.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#36

Post by mattlondon » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:18 PM UTC

jjulius wrote: post #17

walkingthisquai wrote: post #15

I know everyone loves hating on Google here, but some of the changes that they were required to make are genuinely quite annoying. Maps results on the search page don't work like they used to. Clicking the mini-map doesn't open to Google Maps anymore, so you have to relearn some behaviours. I know it's minor stuff (for now), but as a long time happy user of Maps, this kind of thing does not benefit me, and I don't ge…

1.) Click the mini map when the result comes up. 2.) Click the button in the bottom right of the mini map that says, "Open in Maps". Voila! Literally just one extra click or tap - what's the issue? Is a single extra tap really "genuinely quite annoying"?

If that is what was needed to be compliant with DMA, then it makes a mockery of the whole thing.

All the wailing and gnashing of teeth, and it just takes another click to be compliant and everyone is happy? What a waste of everyone's time if it were really that simple and what all the fuss was about.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#37

Post by bbqfog » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:18 PM UTC

IncreasePosts wrote: post #16

bbqfog wrote: post #3

This is a great argument for breaking up Google because they've created an anti-competitive environment where other parties cannot succeed without Google gatekeeping them.

Why should the other parties succeed? IE the aggregator sites? Is it merely because they exist? If I make an aggregator aggregator, should I be able to demand placement on Google search results above mere aggregator sites?

Other parties should succeed because it's good for me, the consumer. If I need to take a trip, it's not in my interest at all for Google to be in the value chain and for me to pay the monopoly penalty as a consumer.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#38

Post by snarbles » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:19 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #34

bbqfog wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No the idea would be that the search would lose its ability to be a monopoly because Chrome + Search + Maps + Android... would stop artificially propping it up in the market. There would be many search engines and the ability for one to drastically impact other industries with UI changes would go away.

But there already are many search engines? I recently got a couple of new windows laptops and Edge defaulted to Bing, but after changing away from Bing it is relentlessly trying to make me set Bing as the default search engine every few days. Note that I am using Edge here, not Chrome. Last time I installed Chrome I think it forced me to pick a default search engine, and didn't endlessly harass me to pick Google as i…

Edge, Bing, and Safari do not have majority market share. It would still please me to see these companies broken up. They have their own obnoxious and/or harmful practices that are the result or of attempts to be monopolistic.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#39

Post by dylan604 » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:19 PM UTC

therealmarv wrote: post #23

Too late too slow. Google in European Union feels already today like a different website in comparison to Google USA where there is an AI answering (which is totally not enabled in Europe). Meanwhile the crowds slowly adopting asking ChatGPT & Co about hotel recommendations and ChatGPT delivers. And in Europe I need to open maps.google.com to search for places because a direct link from google.com is not allowed. It'…

Interesting. Is that something they do with geofencing or by TLD? If I go to google.eu, I get redirected to google.co.uk. After Brexit, is this by design on theGoog's part to not have to abide by EU laws? Do I need a VPN so my IP appears to actually be from within the EU?

I'm really curious to see differences in how theGoog behaves.

Re: An update on Google's compliance with the DMA

#40

Post by bbqfog » Tue, Nov 26, 2024, 5:21 PM UTC

Suppafly wrote: post #30

bbqfog wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No the idea would be that the search would lose its ability to be a monopoly because Chrome + Search + Maps + Android... would stop artificially propping it up in the market. There would be many search engines and the ability for one to drastically impact other industries with UI changes would go away.

>There would be many search engines and the ability for one to drastically impact other industries with UI changes would go away. Honestly that's just wishful thinking. Generally these monopolies, regardless of 'artificial propping up' tend to be fairly natural monopolies and these sorts of changes just make it harder on people to get the experience they had before and prefer.

Not true, look at what happened to Internet Explorer after MS was forced to allow people to uninstall it.