Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 73 posts

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#31

Post by gertop »

cpach wrote: post #24
pcb-rework wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're a fool if you believe handing over metadata like your personal phone number so you can be tracked is an improvement. That's not email and not a replacement for GPG, something that actually works properly. Session is a superior app for text replacement. I think you need to find new blogs that don't offer crap advice.

What kind of threat model do you operate under where Signal Technology Foundation knowing (one of) your phone numbers is a large risk?

The fact that signal knows my phone number doesn't bother me.

The fact that anyone who knows my phone number can know that I use signal does bother me.

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#32

Post by gertop »

danjl wrote: post #17
p_l wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about backups - it's about loss of ongoing use infrastructure

The backup mitigates the problem because, if you are banned, which only happens to fools and fakes, you can take the backup and set it up on another service. Sure, you lose a couple of days of time migrating, but that's not a reason to avoid choosing a better solution.

> if you are banned, which only happens to fools and fakes

If that is truly how you feel then I pity the fools who give you their business.

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#33

Post by cpach »

gertop wrote: post #31
cpach wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of threat model do you operate under where Signal Technology Foundation knowing (one of) your phone numbers is a large risk?

The fact that signal knows my phone number doesn't bother me. The fact that anyone who knows my phone number can know that I use signal does bother me.

May I ask why you’re bothered by this fact?

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#34

Post by cpach »

midenginedcoupe wrote: post #26
pcb-rework wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're a fool if you believe handing over metadata like your personal phone number so you can be tracked is an improvement. That's not email and not a replacement for GPG, something that actually works properly. Session is a superior app for text replacement. I think you need to find new blogs that don't offer crap advice.

They resisted this change for years, but eventually gave in and fixed it. You no longer need to hand out your phone number. https://signal.org/blog/phone-number-privacy-usernames/

Nitpick: AFAIK, revealing a phone number is required for registration. But it’s no longer required in order to communicate with other Signal users.

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#35

Post by akimbostrawman »

roastedpeacock wrote: post #22
pcb-rework wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're a fool if you believe handing over metadata like your personal phone number so you can be tracked is an improvement. That's not email and not a replacement for GPG, something that actually works properly. Session is a superior app for text replacement. I think you need to find new blogs that don't offer crap advice.

Session started as a fork of the Signal client/server to use identifiers that are not phone numbers (perfectly sensible) but having deviated from the known primitives of the Signal protocol and omitting PFS gives me pause.

Session was the go to couple years ago but now SimpleX chat is imo superior with proper PFS even quantum resistent and better UX.

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#36

Post by millzlane »

coldtrait wrote: post #30
millzlane wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, my dumbass used Google voice as my main 2fa number and recently lost access to it. Can't get it back and I'm locked out of everything. Don't be like me. Google really can't be trusted for personal or business use. If I could talk to a human and pay $100 for it I would.

I used to live in the US and use voice as my primary number for everything. I don't think there is a better option.

Just use it everyday and you'll be good.

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#37

Post by justinclift »

danjl wrote: post #17
p_l wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about backups - it's about loss of ongoing use infrastructure

The backup mitigates the problem because, if you are banned, which only happens to fools and fakes, you can take the backup and set it up on another service. Sure, you lose a couple of days of time migrating, but that's not a reason to avoid choosing a better solution.

> which only happens to fools and fakes

Lots of people have directly stated otherwise. Are you super sure they're wrong?

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#38

Post by justinclift »

cpach wrote: post #14
pcb-rework wrote: post #9

Proton suffers from the Lavabit problem but worse, it pretends to offer security and freedom when it does neither and acts as a tool of foreign governments to abuse individuals. Use your own GPG keys and better clients, preferably with self-hosting in Iceland or Sweden.

For truly sensitive communication, it’s better to use Signal: https://soatok.blog/2024/11/15/what-to-use-instead-of-pgp/

You mean the company with a HQ in the US?

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#39

Post by authorfly »

southernplaces7 wrote: post #27
authorfly wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is eventually you need it for Google Ads, or YouTube really for many things. And none of them are "vital" if they go wrong. They aren't core income pipeline parts. And then you get sucked in. B2B and go to a conference? Where are you putting your video demo reels/talks? YouTube Consumer and testing marketing messages for something non-consumer? Google Ads. Your B2B client wants you to provide your SaaS via a…

Needing Google occasionally is understandable but keeping it to a minimum and as disconnected as possible from core business functionality, and as replaceable as possible if things go sideways with its brainless algorithms, is absolutely doable. Please, enough justification for why almost anyone generally "needs" Google. For example: >B2B and go to a conference? Where are you putting your video demo reels/talks? YouT…

I agree with you as a technical guy. It's not the worst. But as to why is happens:

If your business-focused founder or Marketing guy is going to the conference, it'll be Youtube, even though Vimeo is accessible. Unless you go make the account, share it to them, and have a SOP, why would they look at Vimeo?

The problem is when you get any sort of size the non-tech people choose Google as a default and then it (with weak force) slowly black holes up what they do. Just like people chose Microsoft Office (and still do for mature corps) for all kinds of admin, not necessarily technical people using Google (although I would say >80% of the tech graduate emails I am given for contact past graduation are gmail which is a sign of the times!)

Re: Has anyone used Proton Business Suite rather than Google's for a startup?

#40

Post by roastedpeacock »

akimbostrawman wrote: post #35
roastedpeacock wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Session started as a fork of the Signal client/server to use identifiers that are not phone numbers (perfectly sensible) but having deviated from the known primitives of the Signal protocol and omitting PFS gives me pause.

Session was the go to couple years ago but now SimpleX chat is imo superior with proper PFS even quantum resistent and better UX.

And how is the situation with desktop clients? Last I saw the situation was not exactly great.
Post reply on HN