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Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

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Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#31

Post by pablobaz »

incognito124 wrote: post #8

I've experienced rapid warming of hands when handling snow without gloves. Maybe it's the same mechanism?

What you are seeing is probably cold induced vasodilation

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4843861/

Incidentally there are some studies that show you get better at it with more frequent exposure. I have kayaked for many years and have found this to be the case - if my hands get cold now, dipping them into the water to further cool then hence opening the veins is very effective if counterintuitive way of warming my hands up.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#32

Post by aspenmayer »

crazygringo wrote: post #28
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Butter on burns was passed down to my mom. I let that one die off with her generation.

I dunno, I can see logic to that. Today we apply petroleum jelly (Vaseline, Neosporin, etc.) over skin to help it heal, but butter is basically going to do the same thing of keeping in moisture.

I think the reasoning with topical coatings for burns is actually something to do with avoiding gases touching the burned area, which is why they use oxygen tents for people with severe burns over a large area. Petroleum jelly and other similar products block the air from touching the burn also.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#33

Post by aspenmayer »

WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #24
robbiep wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without being overly condescending, you do realise that most of the things that have been done throughout history, along with many we still do, are the result of cultural practice and have no evidence base whatsoever? Whilst 1956 seems to be a fairly late date to stop what would seem in the surface to be a counter intuitive practice, 80 years earlier blood letting was still in vogue

Butter on burns was passed down to my mom. I let that one die off with her generation.

You might look into it to see if there’s something special about butter versus other oils/fats that may make butter specifically good for burns, but I understand that as keeping the air off of the burn, similarly to how oxygen tents work.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#34

Post by kstrauser »

aspenmayer wrote: post #32
crazygringo wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, I can see logic to that. Today we apply petroleum jelly (Vaseline, Neosporin, etc.) over skin to help it heal, but butter is basically going to do the same thing of keeping in moisture.

I think the reasoning with topical coatings for burns is actually something to do with avoiding gases touching the burned area, which is why they use oxygen tents for people with severe burns over a large area. Petroleum jelly and other similar products block the air from touching the burn also.

Nope. It's to form a barrier to keep bacteria out, with the downside that it also traps bacteria in.

Also, oxygen's a gas.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#35

Post by aspenmayer »

kstrauser wrote: post #34
aspenmayer wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the reasoning with topical coatings for burns is actually something to do with avoiding gases touching the burned area, which is why they use oxygen tents for people with severe burns over a large area. Petroleum jelly and other similar products block the air from touching the burn also.

Nope. It's to form a barrier to keep bacteria out, with the downside that it also traps bacteria in. Also, oxygen's a gas.

I find that oils such as petroleum jelly or olive oil do provide pain relief for burns. I can only speculate as to the method of action, but I’m clearly not the only one. Apparently even air movement or contact can cause pain to burns due to the exposure of the dermis, and possibly other reasons.

> Also, oxygen's a gas.

Yeah, I think it must be carbon dioxide or some other gas that is naturally occurring in the atmosphere that causes the painful sensation, otherwise they wouldn’t use specifically oxygen?

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#36

Post by AlotOfReading »

I can easily see where you would get the idea to rub snow on the tissue from my own experiences with second degree frostbite. I did lukewarm water and that hurt. It felt like my hands were going to explode. Every impulse was screaming that it was exactly the wrong thing to do and I should go back outside where the pain was less.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#37

Post by buescher »

crazygringo wrote: post #28
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Butter on burns was passed down to my mom. I let that one die off with her generation.

I dunno, I can see logic to that. Today we apply petroleum jelly (Vaseline, Neosporin, etc.) over skin to help it heal, but butter is basically going to do the same thing of keeping in moisture.

I wonder if cultured butters of the past also might have had anti-microbial properties.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#38

Post by tharkun__ »

exe34 wrote: post #12
robbiep wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without being overly condescending, you do realise that most of the things that have been done throughout history, along with many we still do, are the result of cultural practice and have no evidence base whatsoever? Whilst 1956 seems to be a fairly late date to stop what would seem in the surface to be a counter intuitive practice, 80 years earlier blood letting was still in vogue

people still pray to personal gods to this day, expecting them to prioritise their petty little lives while others are suffering/dying of things that could be trivially solved with a bit of knowledge and technology.

And people "manifest" and somehow don't wonder why randomly "it works" or "doesn't work".

"Must've done something wrong while manifesting this time :shrug:"

:facepalm: !!!!!1111eleven

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#39

Post by steve_adams_86 »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #36

I can easily see where you would get the idea to rub snow on the tissue from my own experiences with second degree frostbite. I did lukewarm water and that hurt . It felt like my hands were going to explode. Every impulse was screaming that it was exactly the wrong thing to do and I should go back outside where the pain was less.

I had the same experience. I stepped into a hot shower with frostbite in two of my toes (just half of my big toe and bit of the the next toe over) and I inadvertently screamed and fell over, ripping the shower curtain down and everything. I wanted out badly. There’s no aching sensation quite like it that I’ve experienced. I’d definitely fail the gom jabbar.

I still can’t feel anything in that side of my big toe, and it occasionally throbs mildly and I think of how incredibly painful serious and extensive frostbite would really be.

Re: Why did people rub snow on frozen feet? (2017)

#40

Post by fuzztester »

WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #20
bongodongobob wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it's extremely painful. I jumped into a frozen lake years ago and ran to a shower afterwards. Turned on the water, just slightly warm and it felt like my fingers and toes got smashed by a hammer.

A friend was a Vietnamese POW. The first torture done was to tourniquet his upper arms until they colored to black and then loose the bindings (repeatedly). Returning circulation is much more brutal than it might sound.

That story reminds me of the Stockdale Paradox:

https://www.jimcollins.com/concepts/Stockdale-Concept.html

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Stockdale

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