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Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

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Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#31

Post by andylynch »

hggigg wrote: post #23
marshray wrote: post #11

I remember my wife describing the funny look she got from our "traditional" next door neighbor as she took the latest edition of the BSD journal out of the mailbox. Never went any further than that. But if you choose to use a literal hell-themed demon as your product's logo, don't be surprised if it limits your user base.

We used to have Demon internet in the UK. The local vicar told us proudly that he was using it and thought it was funny. Depends how backwards people are…

Typical :). Our one collects mistletoe and hands it out after Christmas service to acknowledge the old ways, and says so with a smile while passing it out!

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#32

Post by BSDobelix »

hggigg wrote: post #21

Eh could be worse. My daughter’s boyfriend’s parents won’t use Apple stuff because the logo has a bite out of it. Hilariously though they are paranoid about China and Chinese influence and go on about it all the time including Apple making stuff in China but have Huawei phones.

It's not just the bite but the Apple I was first sold for 666$

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#33

Post by CppPro »

BSDobelix wrote: post #30

@CppPro the logo really annoys you, doesn't it? 2 days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41818595 >>1. Change the logo from a demon to something else. (no matter if it is a play on the word "deamon", it is repulsive to many of the 2.4 billion Christians that can be potential users of FreeBSD)

I have been denounced :(

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#34

Post by BSDobelix »

veltas wrote: post #26

The FreeBSD Code of Conduct mentions being welcoming to people regardless of religion, but by using imagery that explicitly comes from religious depictions of evil in their logo they're blatantly being unwelcoming to a lot of religious people. Would they react differently (albeit more politely) if someone complained today, now the Code of Conduct exists, especially as 'fixing' this would require a full rebrand? I thi…

> blatantly being unwelcoming to a lot of religious people.

It's maybe a clever tactic to keep religious extremists away.

>as a Christian I would say it is appropriate to refuse to do business with someone using such images

Send from a Iphone ;)

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#35

Post by ahoka »

marshray wrote: post #11

I remember my wife describing the funny look she got from our "traditional" next door neighbor as she took the latest edition of the BSD journal out of the mailbox. Never went any further than that. But if you choose to use a literal hell-themed demon as your product's logo, don't be surprised if it limits your user base.

It limits it for the better.

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#36

Post by BSDobelix »

CppPro wrote: post #33
BSDobelix wrote: post #30

@CppPro the logo really annoys you, doesn't it? 2 days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41818595 >>1. Change the logo from a demon to something else. (no matter if it is a play on the word "deamon", it is repulsive to many of the 2.4 billion Christians that can be potential users of FreeBSD)

I have been denounced :(

Keep your head up ;)

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#37

Post by gpvos »

hggigg wrote: post #23
marshray wrote: post #11

I remember my wife describing the funny look she got from our "traditional" next door neighbor as she took the latest edition of the BSD journal out of the mailbox. Never went any further than that. But if you choose to use a literal hell-themed demon as your product's logo, don't be surprised if it limits your user base.

We used to have Demon internet in the UK. The local vicar told us proudly that he was using it and thought it was funny. Depends how backwards people are…

Their phone numbers all had 666 in them, if I recall correctly.

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#38

Post by krackers »

pyuser583 wrote: post #28

“It’s not the Devil, it’s a daemon.” That’s a not a conversation I would want to have. The etymology of “daemon” in the computer sense is Maxwell’s Daemon, a thought experiment involving a mischievous demon. Even to an above average intelligence person, that’s a lot of explaining. Most pre-modern peoples believed in demons, and most people believe images have power. This seems like a violation of the best practices o…

From Wikipedia, "Daemon is actually a much older form of "demon"; daemons have no particular bias towards good or evil, but rather serve to help define a person's character or personality"

That being said, while the etymology of the term may not be directly referring to the modern rendition as the "devil", doesn't the logo (red thing with horns and trident) directly reference it (as a pun on daemon/demon)?

In some sense I do _understand_ where the person in OP's story is coming from. We imbue words and images with power through collective culture (Stallman certainly has remarked on the power of a name, see [1]), and if you had placed great (negative) emotional weight behind a concept, then you would be distressed to see it in something you interact with.

Ironically I think if the actual logo ended up being the "bad taste" version Wikipedia mentions as

>a picture of the BSD Daemon blowtorching a Solaris logo

it'd actually end up as more acceptable since it now gets framed as a narrative ("why a demon? Because who else would dare take on solaris")

[1] https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/why-call-it-the-swindle.en.ht...

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#39

Post by probably_wrong »

dagmx wrote: post #14
weinzierl wrote: post #8

The BSD logo was originally drawn by John Lassetter , who would later write and direct Toy Story and a couple of other successful movies. https://www.jacobelder.com/2024/01/17/director-of-toy-story-... Previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39030991 EDIT: While the John Lassetter version became most popular he did not draw the original. Thanks to dagmx for pointing that out and the additional backg…

This is sort of incorrect. The BSD daemon was originally drawn by Phil Foglio. As seen here https://www.mckusick.com/beastie/jpg/foglio.jpg Lasseter did a later (more current and iconic) revision. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_Daemon?wprov=sfti1 Also John did more than just direct Toy Story. Lasseter was one of the founders of Pixar , directed several movies, took over the chief creative officer role for both Pix…

*multiple Hugo Award winner Phil Foglio.

I get that John Lasseter is probably the most well-known, but Phil Foglio and the Girl Genius team have been releasing quality work for decades.

Re: Superstitious Users and the FreeBSD Logo

#40

Post by Joker_vD »

The strange thing is, there are lot of cathedral churches with all sorts of demonic-looking creatures on them as decorations; not to mention quite an amount of folklore in which some saint or other would overpower the lesser imps with the strength of his faith and make them do his bidding.
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