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Of course this company is for sale

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Re: Of course this company is for sale

#31

Post by erehweb »

wpietri wrote: post #8
Alan01252 wrote: post #2

I've had a lot of recent discussions about this. My Dad always says one of the worst decisions he made when he was running his first company was not to sell it. The price was right, but he could see was the turnover and the potential to earn more later. Little did he know the 90's recession was just around the corner. I often wonder what I'd do now if faced with a similar situation.

It can be dangerous to do path-not-taken analysis like that. If he sold it to idiots who ran it into the ground, he might now be saying, "I can't believe I sold my company to those assholes. Worst decision I ever made." Some years back, The Economist covered a study that showed that half of all mergers destroyed value. And that was in pure dollar terms. A lot of acquirers do things that are financially profitable but…

True on path-not-taken analysis. But in general, people find regrets from actions (e.g. selling the company) much easier to rationalize than from inaction (not selling). See "Stumbling On Happiness"

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#32

Post by Narkov »

raganwald wrote: post #18

Some things are not be for sale. I own a replica of Jackie Robinson’s Kansas City Monarchs Negro League Jersey. I wear it to baseball games (where else?) I once was offered $100, cash for the jersey at a Blue Jays game. I said “no.” The offer was raised to $200. Again, no. I explained it wasn’t for sale. The fellow offering me the money explained that “everything was for sale.” I find such people manipulative. They h…

What if someone offered you a million dollars for the jersey? Perhaps a billion dollars? Everything is for sale.

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#33

Post by raganwald »

Narkov wrote: post #32
raganwald wrote: post #18

Some things are not be for sale. I own a replica of Jackie Robinson’s Kansas City Monarchs Negro League Jersey. I wear it to baseball games (where else?) I once was offered $100, cash for the jersey at a Blue Jays game. I said “no.” The offer was raised to $200. Again, no. I explained it wasn’t for sale. The fellow offering me the money explained that “everything was for sale.” I find such people manipulative. They h…

What if someone offered you a million dollars for the jersey? Perhaps a billion dollars? Everything is for sale.

That isn’t a sale in any reasonable definition of the word, it’s akin to asking, “What if the Death Star was in orbit around the Earth and Darth Vader asked me to sell or witness the destruction of Earth?"

“For Sale” in an unreasonable, extreme circumstance is not on a smooth continuum with $200. You can’t say, Well, if $1,000,000, what about $100,000? What about $10,000? What about $1,000? What about $100? What about $10? What about $1?

Somewhere between $1,000,000 and $1 is a discontiguous gulf that demonstrates the two are entirely different kinds of transactions. If you want to use “For Sale” to indicate everything from Darth Vader to $1,000,000 to $100, you need a new set of words to differentiate $100 from $1,000,000 if we’re going to be able to have any kind of interesting conversation about marketplaces.

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#34

Post by dhimes »

raganwald wrote: post #33
Narkov wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if someone offered you a million dollars for the jersey? Perhaps a billion dollars? Everything is for sale.

That isn’t a sale in any reasonable definition of the word, it’s akin to asking, “What if the Death Star was in orbit around the Earth and Darth Vader asked me to sell or witness the destruction of Earth?" “For Sale” in an unreasonable, extreme circumstance is not on a smooth continuum with $200. You can’t say, Well, if $1,000,000, what about $100,000? What about $10,000? What about $1,000? What about $100? What abou…

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years

http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#35

Post by raganwald »

dhimes wrote: post #34
raganwald wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn’t a sale in any reasonable definition of the word, it’s akin to asking, “What if the Death Star was in orbit around the Earth and Darth Vader asked me to sell or witness the destruction of Earth?" “For Sale” in an unreasonable, extreme circumstance is not on a smooth continuum with $200. You can’t say, Well, if $1,000,000, what about $100,000? What about $10,000? What about $1,000? What about $100? What abou…

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Amusing anecdote, but faulty reasoning. I’ll tell the story another way: Would you betray your country if I kidnapped you and your family, rendered you to a secret location in the third world, and tortured your children? You would? Here’s $100, betray your country. We’ve already established that you’re a traitor, we’re simply haggling over terms.

That is clearly ridiculous, the word “traitor” clearly means something a little more than “There exists at least one set of circumstances—no matter how extreme--under which this person would betray their country.”

The expression “This jersey is for sale” means something a little more than “There exists at least one circumstance—no matter how extreme—under which I would sell the jersey.” If it doesn’t, we might as well throw it out of the English language, because it would convey zero bits of information.

When we say “Everything is for sale,” we don’t mean “Because I can kidnap your family or drive an armoured car full of cash to your house,” unless we’re members of the Hutt clan. In the OP, the CEO is discussing how the company being for sale affects everything they do. He doesn’t mean, “We do what we do because someone may kidnap my children,” he means “We do what we do because I’m open to negotiating the sale of this company at any time."

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#36

Post by moron »

raganwald wrote: post #35
dhimes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Amusing anecdote, but faulty reasoning. I’ll tell the story another way: Would you betray your country if I kidnapped you and your family, rendered you to a secret location in the third world, and tortured your children? You would? Here’s $100, betray your country. We’ve already established that you’re a traitor, we’re simply haggling over terms. That is clearly ridiculous, the word “traitor” clearly means something…

You are bang on with this. Well said.

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#37

Post by moron »

raganwald wrote: post #35
dhimes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Amusing anecdote, but faulty reasoning. I’ll tell the story another way: Would you betray your country if I kidnapped you and your family, rendered you to a secret location in the third world, and tortured your children? You would? Here’s $100, betray your country. We’ve already established that you’re a traitor, we’re simply haggling over terms. That is clearly ridiculous, the word “traitor” clearly means something…

You are bang on with this. Well said.

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#38

Post by danshapiro »

petercooper wrote: post #9

He was extremely clear that anything less than a multibillion dollar IPO was a pathetic failure, and he’d resign before he’d let such an abomination happen. So his startup is not actually for sale. An IPO is essentially a partial sale. But, really, if someone came and offered him $30bn right now, would he sell? If so, it's for sale (and, yep, there are certainly people who would never sell certain things at any price…

An IPO simply means that the company's shares, either ones previously issued or new shares that are minted simultaneously with the IPO, can be purchased by the public. It just opens up investment to a wider pool of people.

Now one can argue that any kind of investment is a "sale" but that's another discussion.

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#39

Post by dhimes »

raganwald wrote: post #35
dhimes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Amusing anecdote, but faulty reasoning. I’ll tell the story another way: Would you betray your country if I kidnapped you and your family, rendered you to a secret location in the third world, and tortured your children? You would? Here’s $100, betray your country. We’ve already established that you’re a traitor, we’re simply haggling over terms. That is clearly ridiculous, the word “traitor” clearly means something…

I agree with you BTW

Re: Of course this company is for sale

#40

Post by sltkr »

raganwald wrote: post #35
dhimes wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We've already established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price" -- anecdote punch-line attributed to various people over the years http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling/

Amusing anecdote, but faulty reasoning. I’ll tell the story another way: Would you betray your country if I kidnapped you and your family, rendered you to a secret location in the third world, and tortured your children? You would? Here’s $100, betray your country. We’ve already established that you’re a traitor, we’re simply haggling over terms. That is clearly ridiculous, the word “traitor” clearly means something…

There is a difference between putting someone under duress and making an offer they can't refuse.

If your wedding ring is not “for sale” for any amount of money, I might still be able to coerce you into “selling” it by putting a gun against your (or your spouse's!) head. But then it wasn't “for sale” in any real sense, because you didn't freely agree to the sale. The same applies to your hostage situation.

However, if you sell your wedding ring for $1,000,000 cash, take it or leave it, then you were willing to sell it, and thus, in my opinion, it was for sale.

Of course there is some grey area (what if you need money to cure a terrible disease?) but that doesn't change the principle: if you'd freely sell something precious for a lot of money, it was for sale. Being offered large amount of money is not, in itself, an extenuating circumstance.

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