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PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

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Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#31

Post by squarefoot »

throwaway42668 wrote: post #26

Ugh. Increasingly what bothers me about stuff like this is that we’re endlessly organizing more and more and more of our economic activity around marketing and advertising, and it chokes off the air-supply for so many other business models, products, and innovation pursuits. The data privacy part? Sure, that’s annoying and troublesome, but God help me… can there be more of a point to everything than targeting & deliv…

> we’re endlessly organizing more and more and more of our economic activity around marketing and advertising

That is the predictable result of a business model based on overproduction and obsolescence. There are already too many products and services compared to the number of pockets that could or want to buy them, therefore businesses struggle for potential customers attention. I don't see any sign of a change in the near future and am well prepared to see more and more space and time filled with advertising of some sort.

Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#32

Post by Zambyte »

bitvoid wrote: post #30
Zambyte wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like store bought gift cards, or an online service? If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else (which may be what you want, but it's worth making that explicitly understood).

Quite a few banks, like Capital One, let you create one-time-use or temporary cards in their apps. So, not really shifting trust outside of the bank providing the account to begin with.

Well before the bank would only see your transfers to PayPal, rather than where you're actually spending your money. You're shifting trust in the sense that it used to be PayPal seeing where you're spending your money to your bank seeing where you're spending your money.

Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#33

Post by jasonjayr »

Semaphor wrote: post #25
jasonjayr wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not widely known but lookup "Level 3 Data" when processing credit card transactions. Your whole receipt is sent to the CC companies, and used for ... well whatever you agreed to let them use it for. You read all the fine print, right?

I looked it up, and it seems L3 is only used by Visa and MC, and only for B2B/B2G. Could you link a source supporting your claims?

For obvious reasons, businesses are usually mum about this, but I've seen some reports that Amex takes L3 data for B2C stuff:

https://www.thecreditchronicles.com/blog/tips-and-tricks-for...

> Another suggestion is to watch out for whether your store shares Level 3 (L3) data with your credit card company. These levels indicate how much information about your transaction is shared with the credit card company. L3 data includes the most amount of information, including itemized data about exactly what you purchased. If the store shares L3 data, your credit card company will be able to easily determine that you have been purchasing gift cards.

> Whether a store shares L3 data may be different for Visa and Amex transactions. For Amex transactions, you can look at your statement history on the web (not mobile) Amex website to see if they include an itemized list of what you purchased. If not, then no L3 data has been shared. Thus, we suggest starting by making a small purchase at the retailer to determine if they share L3 data, and only scale up if they do not.

The infrastructure is clearly in place, it's just a matter of if the agreement is in place and if the store is ready to sell out their customers for the discounted interchange rate. I was hoping to find a better link than a CC points hacking site discussing "manufactured spending", but that's what I could find easily. Grocery stores supporting EBT/SNAP/Benefits must have the infrastructure in place to support L3 data: that's how they determine if you the transaction is eligible or not.

Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#34

Post by JohnFen »

Zambyte wrote: post #18
JohnFen wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've already dramatically reduced the amount of stuff I buy online. For things I have to buy online, I can just use one-time-use cards.

Like store bought gift cards, or an online service? If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else (which may be what you want, but it's worth making that explicitly understood).

Store bought, if I have planned ahead. A temporary card that's a feature of my bank if I haven't.

> If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else

Of course -- I'm shifting it to a bank that I already use. So, it still represents a privacy gain in that I'm cutting PayPal out and not bringing anybody new in.

Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#35

Post by JohnFen »

Zambyte wrote: post #32
bitvoid wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite a few banks, like Capital One, let you create one-time-use or temporary cards in their apps. So, not really shifting trust outside of the bank providing the account to begin with.

Well before the bank would only see your transfers to PayPal, rather than where you're actually spending your money. You're shifting trust in the sense that it used to be PayPal seeing where you're spending your money to your bank seeing where you're spending your money.

Yes, but my bank already has deep insight into my spending habits anyway. Eliminating PayPal reduces the number of companies surveilling me by one. That seems like a net gain to me.

And that's not even taking into account that I trust my bank more than I trust PayPal.

Re: PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers

#36

Post by pquki4 »

jasonjayr wrote: post #33
Semaphor wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I looked it up, and it seems L3 is only used by Visa and MC, and only for B2B/B2G. Could you link a source supporting your claims?

For obvious reasons, businesses are usually mum about this, but I've seen some reports that Amex takes L3 data for B2C stuff: https://www.thecreditchronicles.com/blog/tips-and-tricks-for... > Another suggestion is to watch out for whether your store shares Level 3 (L3) data with your credit card company. These levels indicate how much information about your transaction is shared with the credit card company. L3 data…

For one, when purchasing a Delta ticket with an Amex card, they know exactly where your origin and destination are.
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