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The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

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Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#31

Post by [deleted] »

jjj123 wrote: post #29
edzitron wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please elaborate! I'm genuinely curious.

Honestly, I found it super interesting and the tone worked for me. It’s a comprehensive summary of the poison that is engagement and metrics above all else development. But I will say the tone makes me stop short of sending this to my parents, who actually need to be swayed (whereas I don’t). So if your goal is to be interesting and informative to people who are already on your side, you did well. That’s a worthy eno…

[deleted]

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#32

Post by zaphirplane »

danjl wrote: post #11
edzitron wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please elaborate! I'm genuinely curious.

Placing so much blame on individuals like Zuck and Sandberg is already a stretch. Though leaders have a huge influence, and should bear the responsibility, this piece tries to make it seem like it is those individuals that caused the perceived problems. It even implies that they had "bad" motivations, which is really reaching. Describing the stock classes, the article implies an enormous amount of detailed control on…

CEO sets the culture of a company, the how to get to the generic make money target. They are not the best engineer, sales or accountant. They have a massive influence on how those are done on across dimensions like ethics, risk, legal

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#33

Post by zaphirplane »

danjl wrote: post #23
LightFog wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are trying to suggest that Mark Zuckerberg doesn’t have a detailed knowledge and control over core Meta features, nor knowledge of the societal damage they can do?

No, I am not. You are employing a logical fallacy known as "Denying the antecedent". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denying_the_antecedent

My casual reading of the thread says you are falling for a variance of the fallacy

Someone isn’t knowledgeable and responsible for every detail of every feature means they are responsible and knowledgeable for none

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#34

Post by csande17 »

milderworkacc wrote: post #30

Not sure where to start with this one. Can anybody briefly explain what a “rot economist” is? Is it meant to be capitalised “ROT economist” which stands for something? Has my browser not rendered the characters correctly or something? This story of course includes the now almost mandatory attack on e2e encryption, which according to this account when coupled with the people you know feature is “a dangerous tool” - wi…

"Rot economists" appears to be a pejorative invented by this newsletter to describe an ecosystem of graphs-go-up growth-at-all-costs venture capital firms, management consultants, and corporate leaders who are pushing companies away from building things customers actually want: https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-rot-economy/

It's "rot" as in the companies/society are (metaphorically) rotting.

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#35

Post by dasil003 »

There's a fair amount of insight in this article buried under layers of insults and ad hominem attacks. Perhaps it's a bit ironic that the author feels the need to frame things in this way to drive engagement because that's what the internet has become. It might feel cathartic to blame Zuckerberg for this, but honestly he was just a fucking kid when these wheels were set in motion, manipulated by forces larger than himself.

The incentives created by capitalism + internet + global web/smart phone adoption mean a lot of what happened was inevitable. If someone in Zuck's position had taken a moral stand along the way, you could just swap out their names with any of a million opportunists ready to swoop in. I say this not to absolve Mark, Sheryl or anyone else involved, but just to recognize that these are systemic failures that need systemic solutions. Pinning the blame on individuals doesn't get us any closer to solving the general problems that all social media platforms invite.

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#36

Post by rnd0 »

dasil003 wrote: post #35

There's a fair amount of insight in this article buried under layers of insults and ad hominem attacks. Perhaps it's a bit ironic that the author feels the need to frame things in this way to drive engagement because that's what the internet has become. It might feel cathartic to blame Zuckerberg for this, but honestly he was just a fucking kid when these wheels were set in motion, manipulated by forces larger than h…

> but just to recognize that these are systemic failures that need systemic solutions.

For literally decades, the institutions and laws that may have provided those solutions have been gutted or eliminated.

Collapse is inevitable.

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#38

Post by astrange »

over_bridge wrote: post #21
gravesisme wrote: post #14

This guy just keeps trying to make money! How dare he increase profits!

You joke but the drive to increase profits at any cost is having pretty insidious impacts on the world. Enshittification is everywhere now with companies being forced to degrade customer experience to appease shareholders. Nothing wrong with making a profit but making additional profit every single quarter is making the western world hostile to most people on average wages. It's too expensive to even live here with o…

The median US household income has increased significantly above inflation in the last few years and the lowest-income households have done significantly better than that because we reached "full employment" and that allows more job changes.

The largest price issue left is housing costs and that has nothing to do with "corporate profits", it's about bad land use regulations.

(Another funny thing about the "ever increasing corporate profits" argument is that it's literally anti-Marxist, as Marxism says the problem with capitalism is its profits continually /decline/ due to over-production.)

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#39

Post by firecall »

LightFog wrote: post #25
danjl wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I am not. You are employing a logical fallacy known as "Denying the antecedent". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denying_the_antecedent

Not intentionally if so - I must be missing something more subtle in your comment.

I read it exactly as you did.

Not sure how your response can be framed as 'Denying the antecedent'. :-/

Re: The People Deliberately Killing Facebook

#40

Post by parineum »

zaphirplane wrote: post #33
danjl wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I am not. You are employing a logical fallacy known as "Denying the antecedent". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denying_the_antecedent

My casual reading of the thread says you are falling for a variance of the fallacy Someone isn’t knowledgeable and responsible for every detail of every feature means they are responsible and knowledgeable for none

> Placing so much blame on individuals like Zuck and Sandberg is already a stretch.

This clearly implies that sime blame is warranted.

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