I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it • Hacker News Board

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#31

Post by mminer237 » Sun, May 19, 2024, 3:34 PM UTC

wakawaka28 wrote: post #11

SOLAR_FIELDS wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds very much like something that someone might hear on Joe Rogan's podcast and think it's a good idea because someone who knows how to put two sentences together sounded like they knew what they were talking about.

Gradual exposure to allergens like urushiol has been a legitimate recognized treatment plan for decades. Animals are able to eat poison ivy and poison oak. It's a brave strategy to eat the stuff, but nobody including smug netizens like yourself knows if it will work for someone else. Everything that works in medicine was probably thought to be ridiculous by someone at one point. Joe Rogan isn't the best source of med…

Ivermectin doesn't work though, and we knew that then even if he did find a single quack doctor to promote it.

And vaccines do reduce transmission, which is all I ever heard about it. Not sure what side effects you're talking about.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#32

Post by ImPostingOnHN » Sun, May 19, 2024, 3:45 PM UTC

freedomben wrote: post #27

SOLAR_FIELDS wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pointing out that at some points Joe Rogan might have been smeared unjustly by mainstream media does not in any way come close to absolving the crimes JR has committed against modern science by giving constant airtime to outright quacks. Anyone remotely interested in making sure proper science knowledge and education makes it out to gen pop should be completely against Rogan and everything he stands for. It only take…

This is the most anti-science attitude I think I've seen in a very long time. It's also foolish and dangerous IMHO, because it greatly contributes to the very thing you want to prevent: amplification and creation of quack science to the gen pop. Simply depriving these people of airtime does NOT quash their views and make them go away. It fuels conspiracy theories such as about how big pharma is censoring ideas about…

> Simply depriving these people of airtime does NOT quash their views and make them go away.

> We should know by now that censoring information these days does not work

This argument (repeated) is a bit of a red herring. I haven't seen anyone saying we can make pseudoscience go away forever. We're just questioning the wisdom of embracing and amplifying it to reach people it wouldn't have before.

> It fuels conspiracy theories

This is kind of a corollary to the above point: People are going to theorize conspiracies no matter what. There are undoubtedly conspiracy theorists who think the exact opposite: that including pseudoscience is a conspiracy to make people think it isn't being censored in other ways.

Thus, that a given action might strengthen or weaken the conspiracy theories of at least 1 pseudoscientist isn't enough to justify doing the action or not. Neither choice will make conspiracy theories go away.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#33

Post by tysam_and » Sun, May 19, 2024, 3:50 PM UTC

wholinator2 wrote: post #26

PaulHoule wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not the first time I’ve heard about it. I can’t condone it but I can’t rule out that some variant of this might work. The reaction to urushiol is an allergic reaction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urushiol and a vaccine is under development https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDC-APB Some people just don’t react to it while others do. I had hay fever as a kid which developed into asthma in my 30s, I had immune therapy…

Jus fyi but the "non drowsy" antihistamines are fundamentally different or anything, they're just the same type of drowsy antihistamine but with the dose lowered so it barely works unless you take more than one, thereby making it drowsy again

This is incorrect enough as to be dangerous (IMPE, I am not a doctor). They are non-drowsy because they do not cross the blood brain barrier effectively as I understand. Second and third generation antihistamines are fantastic.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#34

Post by goda90 » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:07 PM UTC

DeathArrow wrote: post #21

Metamizole is the only thing that works for me when I have fever. But it seems that I recently developped an allergy to it, which is a bummer. Every single damn time I take metamizole, I develop very itch rashes. So by taking some substance it seem I became more sensitive to it's side effects, not less.

The immune system is so complex. I have to wonder if allergies develop when something else is stressing the immune system and it misidentifies the culprit.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#35

Post by samtho » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:16 PM UTC

Sebb767 wrote: post #15

skepticalmd wrote: post #14

Absurd that there is zero mention of Mithridates in the article. As always, Chesterton's Fence applies to medicine. Be very wary of anything outside of healthy diet, sleep, exercise, and relationships. If you don't know why your body is fevering, don't lower the fever. If you don't know why your blood pressure is high, don't lower it. We in the medical field vastly overestimate our understanding of human physiology.

> If you don't know why your body is fevering, don't lower the fever. If you don't know why your blood pressure is high, don't lower it. And if you don't know why you have cancer, don't do anything about it? Like, I get the point with fever (which is a known defense mechanism), but high blood pressure is a big problem in the long run and even if it's just a symptom, not doing anything about it is not likely to be the…

The point is that we treat certain things like high blood pressure as a primary issue instead of a secondary one. Instead of addressing something cholesterol, which can often be a lifestyle issue, more emphasis is placed on just taking the statin.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#36

Post by harimau777 » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:24 PM UTC

Does anyone know why desensitization works for some allergies but for other things, like latex, the more you are exposed to them the more likely you are to develop an allergy?

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#37

Post by el_benhameen » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:28 PM UTC

According to family lore, my grandmother’s rural northern-ca elementary school teacher had the class eat some poison oak. Despite living in prime poison oak territory and being a lifelong outdoors person, she never got it. I always assumed it was some wild folk medicine ritual, so it’s interesting to see that there might be some basis for it.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#38

Post by WarOnPrivacy » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:30 PM UTC

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #18

Several kids in our family's social group have successfully undergone desensitization therapy for severe nut allergies. It was much more rigorous than the author's approach, with weekly doctor visits and taking increasingly large amounts of whatever they were allergic to (starting with micrograms of nut powder). I think my niece had the best time as she eventually was advised to start eating daily measured amounts of…

> I mention this mostly because I do think the author was a bit cavalier in his approach

The author may not have had access to a physician with experience in this.

I live in the part of the US where the only physician access is what can be afforded out of pocket (not much). Self initiated treatments are the order of the day.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#39

Post by mmastrac » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:32 PM UTC

skepticalmd wrote: post #14

Absurd that there is zero mention of Mithridates in the article. As always, Chesterton's Fence applies to medicine. Be very wary of anything outside of healthy diet, sleep, exercise, and relationships. If you don't know why your body is fevering, don't lower the fever. If you don't know why your blood pressure is high, don't lower it. We in the medical field vastly overestimate our understanding of human physiology.

This is so wrong, sorry.

Humans evolved to reproduce as a species successfully, not to ensure the optimum survival of an individual. Not everything your body does is in your best interests: something that tends to be the best solution for long-term survival for a group might be entirely wrong for your specific case.

Re: I couldn't escape poison oak, so I started eating it

#40

Post by AlbertCory » Sun, May 19, 2024, 4:32 PM UTC

Doctors are pretty much required to follow Establishment medicine. They're not going to tell you about folk remedies, because it could be malpractice for them.

By way of contrast, I've told my doctor about sinus rinsing, and she was not disapproving. But she said, "a lot of my patients do this and they seem to like it."

I think this is a better response than blanket disapproval. The corresponding response to urushiol desensitization would be "There's no guidance on this. Be very careful! Here are some risks." Which is the best you should expect from an establishment doctor.

A homeopathic doctor would tell you a lot of stuff that might or might not be accurate or safe.