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Bossware is a big legal risk

kolide.com

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Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#31

Post by paxys »

Terr_ wrote: post #12
CoastalCoder wrote: post #7

I was surprised (perhaps I shouldn't have been) to encounter bossware-like surveilance in an interview process . About 6 months ago I was interviewing with InterSystems, a company that does healthcare software. Only when I signed in for the online coding interview did I learn that they required I have a webcam on myself the whole time. I don't like using coarse language. But it was the first time I struggled to not u…

IMO there's a huge difference between "we do this because we had too many fraudulent applicants and this is a compromise compared to having you interview in-person" versus "this is representative of how the entire employment relationship will go." If the former, their fears are not unfounded: Sometimes the person who impressed you in the interview is not actually the same person who arrives for their first day of wor…

So you are okay with giving random companies an hour of footage of your face and part of your house just for the privilege of going through their automated screening round?

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#32

Post by ozim »

Terr_ wrote: post #12
CoastalCoder wrote: post #7

I was surprised (perhaps I shouldn't have been) to encounter bossware-like surveilance in an interview process . About 6 months ago I was interviewing with InterSystems, a company that does healthcare software. Only when I signed in for the online coding interview did I learn that they required I have a webcam on myself the whole time. I don't like using coarse language. But it was the first time I struggled to not u…

IMO there's a huge difference between "we do this because we had too many fraudulent applicants and this is a compromise compared to having you interview in-person" versus "this is representative of how the entire employment relationship will go." If the former, their fears are not unfounded: Sometimes the person who impressed you in the interview is not actually the same person who arrives for their first day of wor…

I agree.

But there still is a line like if I am doing take home assignment I will not install spyware on my personal computer.

We can have a zoom/teams call with a person where I share screen if someone wants that with enabled camera as well during coding or for discussion.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#34

Post by root_axis »

CoastalCoder wrote: post #7

I was surprised (perhaps I shouldn't have been) to encounter bossware-like surveilance in an interview process . About 6 months ago I was interviewing with InterSystems, a company that does healthcare software. Only when I signed in for the online coding interview did I learn that they required I have a webcam on myself the whole time. I don't like using coarse language. But it was the first time I struggled to not u…

How can you vet a candidate remotely without having them on the cam? Especially today with all the LLMs, it's pretty much a hiring requirement if you can't bring the candidate in for an interview.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#35

Post by singleshot_ »

exabrial wrote: post #14
BriggyDwiggs42 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because workers arent slaves or robots, and being on the job doesnt make them such. Your mentality is actually staggering to me.

Can you answer this question directly: What is it that you don't want seen by a company representative, on a company computer, while being paid by the company?

I would not accept employment under any terms that allowed my employer to look at me without my knowledge, or snoop around on my computer without my acquiescence.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#36

Post by kridsdale1 »

davely wrote: post #22
woleium wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just assume it does

No kidding! We have some ridiculous timeout on our work machines that triggers the screensaver after 2 minutes of idle time (we can’t change this). After it’s triggered, you need to enter your password to unlock (company mandated, 10 chars minimum, no repeating chars, at least 1 upper and 1 lower case char, at least 1 special symbol, change every 90 days, can't be too similar to last 10(!) passwords). Okay, this is a…

You can get mechanical mouse mover devices that are not connected to the pc at all. It should be fully undetectable.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#37

Post by mattmerr »

davely wrote: post #22
woleium wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just assume it does

No kidding! We have some ridiculous timeout on our work machines that triggers the screensaver after 2 minutes of idle time (we can’t change this). After it’s triggered, you need to enter your password to unlock (company mandated, 10 chars minimum, no repeating chars, at least 1 upper and 1 lower case char, at least 1 special symbol, change every 90 days, can't be too similar to last 10(!) passwords). Okay, this is a…

Does watching a video pause the timeout? If so, hypothetically one could stream or locally create a video with no contents but long duration.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#38

Post by Terr_ »

ozim wrote: post #32
Terr_ wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO there's a huge difference between "we do this because we had too many fraudulent applicants and this is a compromise compared to having you interview in-person" versus "this is representative of how the entire employment relationship will go." If the former, their fears are not unfounded: Sometimes the person who impressed you in the interview is not actually the same person who arrives for their first day of wor…

I agree. But there still is a line like if I am doing take home assignment I will not install spyware on my personal computer. We can have a zoom/teams call with a person where I share screen if someone wants that with enabled camera as well during coding or for discussion.

> I will not install spyware on my personal computer.

Agreed, if they want to lend me a computer for the exercise, that's another matter. :p

It's been a while since I last interviewed in earnest, but my recollection is that those situations (fortunately) correspond with companies that I probably wouldn't want to work for anyway.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#39

Post by vundercind »

silisili wrote: post #30
CoastalCoder wrote: post #7

I was surprised (perhaps I shouldn't have been) to encounter bossware-like surveilance in an interview process . About 6 months ago I was interviewing with InterSystems, a company that does healthcare software. Only when I signed in for the online coding interview did I learn that they required I have a webcam on myself the whole time. I don't like using coarse language. But it was the first time I struggled to not u…

Wait just during the interview? That actually sounds completely reasonable.

It probably also means signing over rights for the recording to be used for training AI by some third party, plus god knows what else.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#40

Post by GauntletWizard »

davely wrote: post #22
woleium wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just assume it does

No kidding! We have some ridiculous timeout on our work machines that triggers the screensaver after 2 minutes of idle time (we can’t change this). After it’s triggered, you need to enter your password to unlock (company mandated, 10 chars minimum, no repeating chars, at least 1 upper and 1 lower case char, at least 1 special symbol, change every 90 days, can't be too similar to last 10(!) passwords). Okay, this is a…

You are the user I fear most; clever enough the be dangerous and aware of the bullshit.

If you were really smart you would lobby your IT department to change the ridiculously short timeout, and protest by not working when it locks on you during normal pauses.

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