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Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

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Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#31

Post by Smaug123 »

yau8edq12i wrote: post #5

I must say, I'm really skeptical of all these apps. I've tried pretty much all of them (well, not literally all of them, but a lot). I've had to move/travel quite a lot in my life, and I tried to get a "head start" on learning the language, with a different app. Every time, going to the country, I quickly realized that I could not speak the language. At best I could read it and produce with effort some sentences that…

> In English, do you "need" to learn if a word takes "o" or "u"?

English semi-famously remains comprehensible if you replace every vowel with a schwa. So sure you'll have an extremely weird accent, but this is acceptable according to the OP's definition of "speaking a language" from the first paragraph of the article.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#32

Post by vasco »

zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

> You may find yourself having to learn to think in a new way literally.

I've said for a few years now my personality is slightly different when I speak English. I have a partner of several years that doesn't speak my language nor me hers and we communicate in English and even simple things like expressing affection feel different even after a decade.

At some point since I speak more English every day than my own language when I switched to "thinking in English" (not on purpose) I remember feeling very sad, having almost lost a part of me, and I spent some time trying to think what impact it was having on my own actions and behaviors.

Nothing major, but I am more assertive and outspoken in English than in my native language because things don't feel so "real" to say, so it's easier to not feel scared.

I feel very strange sharing this because when I tried I got strange looks but maybe someone recognizes themselves in this too.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#33

Post by ix101 »

deanc wrote: post #22

> Learn only 4 tenses. Past for one time events, past continuous, present, future. These are enough to go by and explain yourself. There is no future tense in Finnish. Or gendered personal pronouns. Oh and there’s about a gazillion words for snow. And god help you if you need to articulate that your spruce is returning.

On the subject of tenses Turkish has a "reported past tense" which I haven't heard in other languages so far. It's very commonly used and simply denotes that someone told you of something that happened. I.e. you didn't witness / weren't present.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#34

Post by jwrallie »

arisAlexis wrote: post #25
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

I can disagree about same family languages. I think the jury is out because you get very confused exactly because of the similarities and can end up speaking "itagnol" or "portunol" etc which is the nightmare of Italian or Brazilian immigrants. It can be easier in grammar for sure.

Exactly, there is a point when proximity between languages means that instead of acquiring a new language, one of your existing languages morphs into the language you are trying to acquire.

I have seen great counter examples of people that could partition their mental spaces and isolate the languages properly.

I had one Spanish teacher in Brazil that could do this. I’m sure she had proper training.

I also had a Spanish friend and her mother was complaining that she was forgetting her home language because she was living in Brazil for some time. This is the most common thing to happen.

Interestingly, as she was telling me this after visiting Spain for about a month, I was having more trouble understanding her than usual, it can go both ways.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#35

Post by ix101 »

Are there any apps specifically targetted at polyglots? It's a niche so I doubt it. I guess you can tell the app that you're native french speaker learning German if you are more proficient in French and picking up German. This way you are training two languages simultaneously.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#36

Post by xboxnolifes »

simlevesque wrote: post #29
felsokning wrote: post #24

> ...OR Series in target language and subtitles in English or native language... In the ever-growing geo-restrictions world, this is no longer as easy as it was in the days of yore. For example, if you're learning Norwegian and you want to watch anything on NRK, you need to get a BankId[1] - for which you need to be a resident _in_ Norway to have. The alternative, of course, is buying DVDs/Blu-Rays on Amazon -- but y…

It's not a geo restriction problem. It's a distribution rights problem. NRK doesn't own the right to distribute what they have worldwide, they bought limited local distribution rights. Why would local broadcasters buy the worldwide license ? It's the producers of the tv shows which need to license their product to a worldwide broadcaster. NRK is only georestricting because the licenses forbids them from not doing it.…

> It's not a geo restriction problem. It's a distribution rights problem.

This is the same thing.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#37

Post by Affric »

felsokning wrote: post #24

> ...OR Series in target language and subtitles in English or native language... In the ever-growing geo-restrictions world, this is no longer as easy as it was in the days of yore. For example, if you're learning Norwegian and you want to watch anything on NRK, you need to get a BankId[1] - for which you need to be a resident _in_ Norway to have. The alternative, of course, is buying DVDs/Blu-Rays on Amazon -- but y…

Yep. The internet means information can be shared almost anywhere on earth simultaneously, and so a great deal of human effort must be spent ensuring this does not happen.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#38

Post by bojan »

vasco wrote: post #32
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

> You may find yourself having to learn to think in a new way literally. I've said for a few years now my personality is slightly different when I speak English. I have a partner of several years that doesn't speak my language nor me hers and we communicate in English and even simple things like expressing affection feel different even after a decade. At some point since I speak more English every day than my own lan…

This certainly resonates with me. In my professional environment I use my third language, and, while it takes more thought to express myself, I am more assertive and open simply because the words carry "less" weight to me. Another positive side is that I'm more difficult to offend or upset.

Sometimes I translate in my head what I just said back to my native language and realise that chances are I wouldn't have said it if I had to actually say it in my native language.

It's weird. It's also not something I think about on a daily basis. It's simply how it works.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#39

Post by nasir »

vasco wrote: post #32
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

> You may find yourself having to learn to think in a new way literally. I've said for a few years now my personality is slightly different when I speak English. I have a partner of several years that doesn't speak my language nor me hers and we communicate in English and even simple things like expressing affection feel different even after a decade. At some point since I speak more English every day than my own lan…

Living the same life. 10 years speaking English with a non English speaking partner and I can say I now fully think in English and in many aspects my English is better than my native language.

Could never put words on it but things don’t feel so real either.

The funniest part is now I speak my native language with my small kids and have fully relapsed to my original home town accent. I had abolished that accent years ago to avoid getting bullied at high school after relocating to a big city.

My kids are actively hearing and speaking 4 languages and one is with a thick accent!

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#40

Post by felsokning »

simlevesque wrote: post #29
felsokning wrote: post #24

> ...OR Series in target language and subtitles in English or native language... In the ever-growing geo-restrictions world, this is no longer as easy as it was in the days of yore. For example, if you're learning Norwegian and you want to watch anything on NRK, you need to get a BankId[1] - for which you need to be a resident _in_ Norway to have. The alternative, of course, is buying DVDs/Blu-Rays on Amazon -- but y…

It's not a geo restriction problem. It's a distribution rights problem. NRK doesn't own the right to distribute what they have worldwide, they bought limited local distribution rights. Why would local broadcasters buy the worldwide license ? It's the producers of the tv shows which need to license their product to a worldwide broadcaster. NRK is only georestricting because the licenses forbids them from not doing it.…

> NRK is only georestricting because the licenses forbids them from not doing it.

I would be more inclined to say that they're doing it to be "safe". For example, their immediate neighbour, Sweden, has a selection "Kan ses utomlands"[2] -- which, roughly, means can see outside of the country.

Presumably, like elsewhere in the world, not everything NRK is showing is licensed only for Norway.

To the original point: The issue isn't that BankId is being used, it's saying you can just watch the originals, in their mother-tongue (person-tongue?).

For example, NRK produces some originals, like Vikingane[3] that eventually became Norsemen[4] on Netflix.

Clearly, that's been licensed for semi-global (if not global) consumption via Netflix; however, as you can see from the NRK link, you still need to login via BankId to watch it in it's original form.

Again: None of this is a problem, per se, but saying that one can just watch original shows - in their original language - isn't congruent at all with reality, these days.

[2] - https://www.svt.se/kontakt/anvand-svt-play-utomlands

[3] - https://tv.nrk.no/serie/vikingane

[4] - https://www.netflix.com/ie/title/80180182

Edit: List formatting fix.

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