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European Accelerationism

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Re: European Accelerationism

#31

Post by readthenotes1 »

willmadden wrote: post #30
readthenotes1 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, really, they did have some respect for learning.

Europeans did not become wealthy from plunder and trade. That's preposterous. In fact, their monarchies were assassinated (Russian), overthrown (French), or otherwise forced into the twilight (UK) by non-European influences, starting in the 17th-18th century. The common Christian religions were brought to heel during the same time.

The East Indies company's didn't exist, or the Compagnie du Congo Belge, etc. and no loot was transferred to Europe from the colonies?

Shocking.

You might want to visit the Louvre and the British Museum.

Re: European Accelerationism

#32

Post by M95D »

morbicer wrote: post #13
willmadden wrote: post #9

Europe was rich because its nations were high trust societies. They were ethnic monocultures with social cohesion, shared history, religion, and culturally aligned, peaceful, productive populations.

Maybe in your dreams. Few counter points: - Austria-Hungaria was a multi ethnic, multi religious, multinational entity - Similar Holy Roman Empire before - House of Habsburgs at some point ruled parts of middle Europe, some Netherlands and Spain - Spain is a multi-national state till today, with strong tensions - Germany was for a long time only a loose group of small countries - Denmark ruling other Scandinavian cou…

You forgot the Bosnia war.

Re: European Accelerationism

#33

Post by snowpid »

octopoc wrote: post #27
snowpid wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Europeans have coexisted within the same political structures for many generations" No, most didn't. Europe wasn't peaceful for a very long time.

TBH it comes across like you're being contrary, not curious. Yes, there's been lots of war. But there are also examples like Switzerland where French- and German- and Italian-speaking people coexist. No, it's not THE SAME EVERYWHERE, but nothing is. But my larger point is, that kind of diversity, while it has had some success in Europe, is a very different thing from the woke kind of diversity.

But why do you make wrong statements?

While French or German speakers in Switzerland works, It didn't work between Germany and France between you know 1810 and 1945. If you grow up in Germany and France this would not be a surprise.

Europe had lots of problems in the past (and usually people learn them in high school). You deny them just because of migration which both happen to be starting in the Germanys and France way earlier before the last 20 years (and also the discussions!). This also a known fact for people who care about these countries. And this is JUST Germany and France. This is not Europe.

If you curious about European or German history start the Wikipedia article , visit the countries instead of following American far right twitter accounts about migration.

Re: European Accelerationism

#34

Post by octopoc »

snowpid wrote: post #33
octopoc wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH it comes across like you're being contrary, not curious. Yes, there's been lots of war. But there are also examples like Switzerland where French- and German- and Italian-speaking people coexist. No, it's not THE SAME EVERYWHERE, but nothing is. But my larger point is, that kind of diversity, while it has had some success in Europe, is a very different thing from the woke kind of diversity.

But why do you make wrong statements? While French or German speakers in Switzerland works, It didn't work between Germany and France between you know 1810 and 1945. If you grow up in Germany and France this would not be a surprise. Europe had lots of problems in the past (and usually people learn them in high school). You deny them just because of migration which both happen to be starting in the Germanys and France…

Actually I hardly ever spend time on Twitter. I prefer reading original sources and trying to decipher biases that are less subtle than the biases on Wikipedia, and therefore more easily read between the lines. But most importantly I’m neither right nor left. I’m non ideological, which means I think all ideologies have at least some truth and many have good ideas, but I’m not going to subscribe to any specific one. I invite you to expand your mental model to include more than just two ways of thinking, left vs. right.

Re: European Accelerationism

#35

Post by snowpid »

octopoc wrote: post #34
snowpid wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why do you make wrong statements? While French or German speakers in Switzerland works, It didn't work between Germany and France between you know 1810 and 1945. If you grow up in Germany and France this would not be a surprise. Europe had lots of problems in the past (and usually people learn them in high school). You deny them just because of migration which both happen to be starting in the Germanys and France…

Actually I hardly ever spend time on Twitter. I prefer reading original sources and trying to decipher biases that are less subtle than the biases on Wikipedia, and therefore more easily read between the lines. But most importantly I’m neither right nor left. I’m non ideological, which means I think all ideologies have at least some truth and many have good ideas, but I’m not going to subscribe to any specific one. I…

"which means I think all ideologies have at least some truth " I doubt it. National Socialism and Communism are clearly counter examples. I'm very curious why haven't you thought about these very important ideologies in European history (both killed millions of Europeans)

"mental model to include more than just two ways of thinking, left vs. right." I do. I guess because you haven't mention which European country you are from and the typical demographic of HN, that you are American. And the American mind can not comprehend European history and links between various conflicts. So most peopöe can not put together into two bins of Politics like in the American election system.

Re: European Accelerationism

#36

Post by willmadden »

readthenotes1 wrote: post #31
willmadden wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Europeans did not become wealthy from plunder and trade. That's preposterous. In fact, their monarchies were assassinated (Russian), overthrown (French), or otherwise forced into the twilight (UK) by non-European influences, starting in the 17th-18th century. The common Christian religions were brought to heel during the same time.

The East Indies company's didn't exist, or the Compagnie du Congo Belge, etc. and no loot was transferred to Europe from the colonies? Shocking. You might want to visit the Louvre and the British Museum.

History is written by the victors. They also control the museums. You might want to read some alternative accounts of modern history with an open mind.

Re: European Accelerationism

#37

Post by lores »

gumby wrote: post #8

> [The] question is how you . . . get Europe to regain self-confidence. I’ve never seen anybody succeeding with a lack of confidence,” The post starts with this quote but the recommendations don't address it. I only semi-jokingly consider there to be a physical continuum from the Bay Area to Europe. In the Bay Area, investors tend to be more afraid of missing out on upside than they are on losing their money. The fur…

The article spends a lot of time pointing out that's a fallacy, though.
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