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Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

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Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#31
post #2

Wars were exponentially more brutal the further back you went

IDK, WW1 sounds like a pretty bad time. Fighting the modern US would be also be some sort of bizarre existential dread, knowing that every move you make is probably tracked and you have a decent chance of being killed with absolutely no warning.

After watching a few clips of drone warfare in Ukraine, I think humanity really needs to start taking a pass on wars.

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#33
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People putting poop or muck on musket balls to cause sepsis.

I wonder what's the payout for individual soldier to do this to have somebody die after the battle has already ended with win or loss.

I think it originated with pooping on swords/polearms: you're a peasant, just before the battle, and you have a massive adrenaline dump, part of which involves clearing out the intestines, so if you manage to channel your inner cat, as you barely get your breeches off you stick your weapon underneath. Then you tell all your buddies you totally just did that on purpose, to cause sepsis among the enemy...

If you're an grizzled noncom equivalent, when the newbies suddenly wind up with a fresh pile of squishy goop, you tell them the same story, and have them run their weapons through it, making them feel better about having squatted down in front of their buddies?

Lagniappe: how about this as a way to take physiological signs of adrenaline and turn them into an "I meant to do that" moment? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_rotEpFtZU&t=64s

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#34
post #23

Ooh i thought it was because the mongols were experts of maneuver warfare.

Being good at tactics can win battles. Being good at strategy can win a war. Being good at economy allows you to win war after war.

The typical phrase is “infantry wins battles, logistics wins wars.” It gets at the same idea as you.

https://www.czdefence.com/article/infantry-wins-battles-logi....

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#35
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exponentially? Not really. In pre-state societies, we generally seem to see around a 15% chance of dying due to warfare in your lifetime. Early states seem to see that fall to around mid-high single digits. And this decreases to tiny fractions in modern times, but mostly because warfare has declined rather than wars becoming less deadly. Brutal episodes of war--say the Eastern Front on WW2 or some of the theaters in…

There's a difference between "young men killed on the battlefield" and "everyone else also being killed" - while (sadly) the latter did happen, e.g. Hiroshima, or as Russian troops swept through Germany, or Dresden, it wasn't par for the course or expected as what happens after the losing side lost.

The Soviets* pretty clearly did not kill all of the civilians in Germany, nor did they attempt to. Unlike the Germans themselves, who exterminated whole towns and had a plan that involved total genocide of their conquered peoples. Pretty wild to miss such an obvious example.

*really neither the sins nor the wins in WWII belong exclusively to the Russians. Another subtlety misleading aspect of this post.

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a difference between "young men killed on the battlefield" and "everyone else also being killed" - while (sadly) the latter did happen, e.g. Hiroshima, or as Russian troops swept through Germany, or Dresden, it wasn't par for the course or expected as what happens after the losing side lost.

The Soviets* pretty clearly did not kill all of the civilians in Germany, nor did they attempt to. Unlike the Germans themselves, who exterminated whole towns and had a plan that involved total genocide of their conquered peoples. Pretty wild to miss such an obvious example. *really neither the sins nor the wins in WWII belong exclusively to the Russians. Another subtlety misleading aspect of this post.

> really neither the sins nor the wins in WWII belong exclusively to the Russians. Another subtlety misleading aspect of this post

I didn't mention any wins. As for the sins: did you get that despite my listing something the British did and something the Americans did?

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK, WW1 sounds like a pretty bad time. Fighting the modern US would be also be some sort of bizarre existential dread, knowing that every move you make is probably tracked and you have a decent chance of being killed with absolutely no warning.

After watching a few clips of drone warfare in Ukraine, I think humanity really needs to start taking a pass on wars.

Sounds excellent to me, but as long as we have drones and they're fighting our conflicts, we should probably think about giving them the vote? (before they start thinking about SkyNet?)

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#38
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was reading up on Wootz steel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wootz_steel And found that Merv was a big producer of it. I had not heard of the city of Merv, seemingly at one point it had ranked as the second largest in the world, and became more fascinated. Although now just ruins, it has inspired a board game: Merv: The Heart of the Silk Road (2020) https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/306040/merv-the-heart-of... “M…

Its a sad story, they were at the global pinnacle of science and arts, opened their gates to mongols without any resistance, only to be still slaughtered like cattle. Imagine how much additional positive influence on current world, how differently middle east region would look like, and islam itself. Lesson to be learned which is still very relevant today - don't trust primitive barbarians to uphold any moral expecta…

[deleted]

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most likely way to die or become an amputee in modern war is being hit by artillery out of nowhere. There’s no glory in that so recruiters don’t talk about it much.

If one thing the Russo-Ukrainian war footage has though me is that scouting drones plus artillery has given both sides big impact sniper rifles.

ive been thinking that down the line both of these would be moved to space

Re: Silk Helped the Armies of Genghis Khan Conquer Asia

#40
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was reading up on Wootz steel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wootz_steel And found that Merv was a big producer of it. I had not heard of the city of Merv, seemingly at one point it had ranked as the second largest in the world, and became more fascinated. Although now just ruins, it has inspired a board game: Merv: The Heart of the Silk Road (2020) https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/306040/merv-the-heart-of... “M…

Its a sad story, they were at the global pinnacle of science and arts, opened their gates to mongols without any resistance, only to be still slaughtered like cattle. Imagine how much additional positive influence on current world, how differently middle east region would look like, and islam itself. Lesson to be learned which is still very relevant today - don't trust primitive barbarians to uphold any moral expecta…

7-10 days of siege doesn't sound like "without any resistance".

(I'd be willing to believe the mongols broke their word on a surrender parley, but it'd be very helpful to have non-persian sources corroborating that)

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